What I'm up to

[JDog2pt0]

MKV does not play well with VLC when it comes to trying to skip ahead in the video.

[BTGBullseye]

MKV does not play well with VLC when it comes to trying to skip ahead in the video.

Yes, that's because VLC is a shitty player. Go get the K-Lite Codec Pack, and use Media Player Classic.

[DaftMink]

Yes, that's because VLC is a shitty player. Go get the K-Lite Codec Pack, and use Media Player Classic.

Another great playback solution is the Combine Community Codec Pack.

 

Mainly recommended by Anime Fansub groups it's 1 simple download which allows you to play anything.

[BTGBullseye]

Another great playback solution is the Combine Community Codec Pack.

 

Mainly recommended by Anime Fansub groups it's 1 simple download which allows you to play anything.

Sorry to say this, but that's like the bastard cousin of K-Lite...

[DaftMink]

Just wondering, what version of the K-Lite pack do you use BTGbullseye ?.

 

I never really used the pack do to getting hooked on the CCCP through my anime.

[Indenial]

Yes, that's because VLC is a shitty player. Go get the K-Lite Codec Pack, and use Media Player Classic.

 

Where does all this nonsense come from anyway? VLC is one of the best players out there. If any player has problems it's MPC, it can't even play MP4's at 30fps, it plays them faster. If a video isn't mod8 in height it crashes. And VLC quality is perfect unless you have a nvidia card, but that's easily fixed too:

 

http://git.videolan.org/gitweb.cgi/vlc.git/?a=commit;h=b545e479ca5bad8fbde534a534dfe22cdfa80e3

 

Besides, even if you have MPC, you don't even need a codec pack. Both players have internal codecs.

[Blightmare]

Another great playback solution is the Combine Community Codec Pack.

 

Mainly recommended by Anime Fansub groups it's 1 simple download which allows you to play anything.

Sorry to say this, but that's like the bastard cousin of K-Lite...

 

Bastard cousin or not, it's worked fine for me.

[BTGBullseye]

Just wondering, what version of the K-Lite pack do you use BTGbullseye ?.

 

I never really used the pack do to getting hooked on the CCCP through my anime.

Mega, newest version, and the x64 packs on my newer systems.

 

*VLC fanboyism*

Your name is quite applicable in this situation... You're in denial of the fact that VLC is a shitty player.

 

If any player has problems it's MPC, it can't even play MP4's at 30fps, it plays them faster. If a video isn't mod8 in height it crashes.

Since when? I have dozens of different MP4 videos that have played perfectly on MPC since the version that came with KLCP 6.70. (the first version I started using)

 

I have however had occasional trouble with the codecs themselves having issues, but that is usually fixed with an update pack within the week.

 

VLC on the other hand can't play anything on any of my systems without dropping at least 1 out of every 40 frames. (shouldn't be possible to lose frames on gaming optimized systems) Add to that the major issues it has with MKV (the soon-to-be industry standard) and you have a shitty player.

 

Bastard cousin or not, it's worked fine for me.

Well, at least you aren't using VLC... Right?

[Blightmare]

Well, at least you aren't using VLC... Right?

 

Using CCCP. I think VLC was among the players I tried that would run MLK and it just crashed every time I launched a video. CCCP works well enough for what I do that I see no need to switch off it unless I have to.

[Indenial]

*VLC fanboyism*

Your name is quite applicable in this situation... You're in denial of the fact that VLC is a shitty player.

 

My nick is actually meant ironic. So, about calling me a fanboy, look up the term "projection", then your anti-mac signature. Give it a sec

 

If I would choose to be a fanboy of anything (glad I left that phase behind me) I would choose XBMC. I love that player, it's just not something you can used a default player, considering it's a complete media center (you can't associate it f.e.).

 

Since when? I have dozens of different MP4 videos that have played perfectly on MPC since the version that came with KLCP 6.70. (the first version I started using)

 

My previous version (1.4. something) and the latest. It's just 1%, so it's virtually unnoticeable, but it's there and since I've got bit-compared perfectly equal picture quality on both VLC and MPC, this tiny difference is actually placing MPC below VLC for playing these kind of video's.

 

But.. the reason I'm putting it here is for the irony of FM episodes going MP4, being 30fps, used to be non MOD8 (pre-35) and VLC getting mentioned as the possible problem.

 

Now, let me put something positive about MPC to show that I'm impartial: MPC supports more formats by default and has the ability to play incomplete files (well avi's as far as I've tested), which is why I like it. That, and the left-click pause thing, but that's just personal preference.

 

I've got mplayer, mpc, vlc, xbmc, winamp, jetaudio, wmp (ofc), and probably more on my machine, but I consider both VLC -and- MPC as the top players, but neither of them is perfect.

 

VLC on the other hand can't play anything on any of my systems without dropping at least 1 out of every 40 frames. (shouldn't be possible to lose frames on gaming optimized systems) Add to that the major issues it has with MKV (the soon-to-be industry standard) and you have a shitty player.

 

I don't have this problem at all, with mkv, mp4, avi, anything. Even when I turn "drop late frames" function back on. 0 lost frames on suckerpunch 720p mkv that's running in the background right now (20 minutes or so).

 

Does your card have a forced v-sync setting? If that's on, it's likely the reason.

 

I'm positive that any problems with any player out there is either minor, or caused by the videocard drivers/configuration and can be fixed with some settings. It's playing perfect here, that's why I'm sure. I remember that when I bought my previous videocard, a 8800GTS, I was also shocked with the horrible video quality, but changing some videosettings fixed that, so it wasn't the player.

[BTGBullseye]

I don't have this problem at all, with mkv, mp4, avi, anything. Even when I turn "drop late frames" function back on. 0 lost frames on suckerpunch 720p mkv that's running in the background right now (20 minutes or so).

 

Does your card have a forced v-sync setting? If that's on, it's likely the reason.

V-sync doesn't affect the frame loss, and yes the program still registers 0 frame loss. Doesn't mean that the program is right.

 

MPC has always beat out VLC on all of my systems. (and I have a large selection to try it on)

[Indenial]

V-sync doesn't affect the frame loss, and yes the program still registers 0 frame loss. Doesn't mean that the program is right.

 

MPC has always beat out VLC on all of my systems. (and I have a large selection to try it on)

 

That V-sync thing was a hunch, I remember I had some strange results with it once. I didn't validate it, but otherwise I can't explain any frameloss, because I can't see it, measure it, find it by testing, with external or internal tools, or simply running MPC and VLC together with the same video, synchronized. There's not a single difference.

 

How do you know? I can make similar claims as you, I've got multiple systems, ati, nvidia cards, so I can easily claim VLC beats MPC on all my systems too. Saying a program could be wrong is hardly proof that it is. It's like saying the flying spaghetti monster exists because I can't prove it doesn't.

[BTGBullseye]

How do you know? I can make similar claims as you, I've got multiple systems, ati, nvidia cards, so I can easily claim VLC beats MPC on all my systems too. Saying a program could be wrong is hardly proof that it is. It's like saying the flying spaghetti monster exists because I can't prove it doesn't.

So nothing will prove it to you then right? I could record what I see on the screen, but you would probly just say that I tampered with it.

[Indenial]

So nothing will prove it to you then right? I could record what I see on the screen, but you would probly just say that I tampered with it.

 

You could at least try.

 

If I'm wrong, I won't like it, but I'm not going to be a dick about it. I've trusted both VLC and MPC. I don't want to use a crappy player, so because of the staements here, I've checked it out. I never heard any of these comments anywhere else (search google), so excuse my skepticism.

 

I don't care about being right, I want a good player.

 

Let me start then.

 

60 second FPS test done with FRAPS on multiple players, including mediainfo data. Source is some mp4 vid someone send me (wanted a legal thing so I could link to it). Downloadable here (you need the downthemall addon)

 

Official framerate from video data: 23.976 fps

 

Testresults:

 

MPC:
Frames, Time (ms), Min, Max, Avg
 1445,     60000,  23,  25, 24.083
 1446,     60000,  23,  26, 24.100
 1445,     60000,  23,  25, 24.083

VLC:
Frames, Time (ms), Min, Max, Avg
 1439,     60000,  23,  24, 23.983
 1439,     60000,  23,  24, 23.983
 1439,     60000,  23,  24, 23.983

Mplayer:
Frames, Time (ms), Min, Max, Avg
 1439,     60000,  23,  25, 23.983

Jetaudio:
Frames, Time (ms), Min, Max, Avg
 1439,     60000,  23,  25, 23.983

XBMC:
Frames, Time (ms), Min, Max, Avg
 1439,     60000,  23,  25, 23.983


General
Complete name                    : D:\DOWNLOAD\50345844.mp4
Format                           : MPEG-4
Format profile                   : Base Media
Codec ID                         : isom
File size                        : 6.02 MiB
Duration                         : 1mn 10s
Overall bit rate                 : 720 Kbps
Encoded date                     : UTC 2011-05-10 22:01:14
Tagged date                      : UTC 2011-05-11 22:01:14

Video
ID                               : 1
Format                           : AVC
Format/Info                      : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile                   : [email protected]
Format settings, CABAC           : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames        : 4 frames
Format settings, GOP             : M=5, N=12
Codec ID                         : avc1
Codec ID/Info                    : Advanced Video Coding
Duration                         : 1mn 10s
Bit rate mode                    : Variable
Bit rate                         : 608 Kbps
Maximum bit rate                 : 1 830 Kbps
Width                            : 640 pixels
Height                           : 360 pixels
Display aspect ratio             : 16:9
Frame rate mode                  : Constant
Frame rate                       : 23.976 fps
Color space                      : YUV
Chroma subsampling               : 4:2:0
Bit depth                        : 8 bits
Scan type                        : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame)               : 0.110
Stream size                      : 5.08 MiB (84%)
Writing library                  : Vimeo Encoder
Encoded date                     : UTC 2011-05-10 22:01:14
Tagged date                      : UTC 2011-05-10 22:01:14

Audio
ID                               : 2
Format                           : AAC
Format/Info                      : Advanced Audio Codec
Format profile                   : LC
Codec ID                         : 40
Duration                         : 1mn 10s
Bit rate mode                    : Variable
Bit rate                         : 109 Kbps
Maximum bit rate                 : 133 Kbps
Channel(s)                       : 2 channels
Channel positions                : Front: L R
Sampling rate                    : 44.1 KHz
Compression mode                 : Lossy
Stream size                      : 934 KiB (15%)
Encoded date                     : UTC 2011-05-10 22:01:14
Tagged date                      : UTC 2011-05-10 22:01:14

 

My conclusion: VLC doesn't seem to be losing frames, but MPC is playing to fast, so it only seems to show more frames.

[Blightmare]

Poor Ross. His little update got turned into an argument about video players.

[Burn7]

Also for those interested in sound editing, what format is good for you for matching sound to video previews? If there's no preference, Xvid AVI is easiest for me.

 

I really don't have a preference, so if AVI saves you time I'm good with that.

 

Poor Ross. His little update got turned into an argument about video players.

 

I just expect this to happen every time I get online. It really doesn't bother me though. I've developed a sort of "Selective Reading" where my brain filters out any arguments that mean absolutely nothing to me.

[the_marshmallow_man]

I read all the arguments regardless, even though I've not got an opinion. Form them for me, random internet people!

[BTGBullseye]

My conclusion: VLC doesn't seem to be losing frames, but MPC is playing to fast, so it only seems to show more frames.

Is it really playing too fast, or just adding frames that aren't there? I've seen it add frames to bring the framerate up to the PAL standard before for mine too, no change in the video duration.

 

[EDIT] Just tested it on mine... It brought it up to that framerate on mine, no duration change.

Edited July 19, 2011 by Guest (see edit history)

[Indenial]

Poor Ross. His little update got turned into an argument about video players.

Oh please, he's not a kid anymore, he can take it and otherwise they're crocodile tears. How about thinking: poor visitors that might needlessly changing their player because of his frontpage statement, or at least poor Ross for getting bad advice. There are people who do care and this argument is for them. I know this would offend the socials (hence my nickname), but it still had to be said. Now grab your lollipops and stuffed animals and go play outside again, chop chop!

[Indenial]

Is it really playing too fast, or just adding frames that aren't there? I've seen it add frames to bring the framerate up to the PAL standard before for mine too, no change in the video duration.

 

I'm not sure and I have no idea how to test that besides taking a longer video and sit next to it with a stopwatch, while also having a framecounter, but I don't really want to go through that much trouble. It's hard syncing an external framecounter with a player and besides, you wouldn't really know if you were just watching.

 

Anyway, when I play 30fps vids in MPC and another player it does outrun it slowly gaining at least a noticeable time difference in sound and a little in video, but it takes a while and it only happens with some vids (maybe NTSC only, that could be it), most of them do play at correct speed. This was actually the first non-30fps that did this.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if the MPC developers didn't even know about this, it's that subtle.

 

Edit: you could download an MP4 version of FM from youtube, play it synchronized in both players and you should be able to notice it