Atheism: Philosophically Redundant?

[danielsangeo]

Is that what you think is the ultimate goal of life? The betterment of our species?

 

Sounds about right to me, do you have a different opinion?

Yes, so far I think that there is no ultimate goal in life. You live. But that is a pretty pathetic thought as I am not smart enough to know that and the chances of that being true are just as high as anything else.

 

The betterment of our species seems quite frankly as just another religious type of belief to me.

Just something to give you meaning as the atheists say.

 

Great. What's wrong with "meaning"? Goals are something we humans made up, so why can't goals be what we want them to be?

 

I'm not going to be religious for the sake of "not knowing the truth". I'm also not going to "believe in a higher power" simply because it would give me comfort against my complete lack of knowledge.

 

So, I'm going to focus on what I know and CAN know. I'm going to ride that rollercoaster. I'm going to fly on that plane. I'm going to get involved in sociopolitical and religious discussions against idiots on the Internet. I'm going to possibly help subtitle Freeman's Mind episodes! I'm going to watch videos on Accursed Farms! I'm going to play the Black Mesa mod when it comes out! I'm going to get a job in computer animation! When life gives you lemons, don't make lemonade. Make life take the lemons back! Get mad! I don't want your damn lemons! What am I supposed to do with these?! Demand to see life's manager! Make life rue the day it thought it could give ME lemons! Do you know who I am? I'm the man who's gonna burn your house down! With the lemons! I'm gonna get my engineers to invent a combustible lemon that burns your house down!

 

.....oh, wait. Sorry.

[Axeldeath]

Okay you should have put [/rant] tags right before the word lemons and right after the "burn your house down" bit

[ProHypster]

Sounds about right to me, do you have a different opinion?

Yes, so far I think that there is no ultimate goal in life. You live. But that is a pretty pathetic thought as I am not smart enough to know that and the chances of that being true are just as high as anything else.

 

The betterment of our species seems quite frankly as just another religious type of belief to me.

Just something to give you meaning as the atheists say.

 

Great. What's wrong with "meaning"? Goals are something we humans made up, so why can't goals be what we want them to be?

 

I'm not going to be religious for the sake of "not knowing the truth". I'm also not going to "believe in a higher power" simply because it would give me comfort against my complete lack of knowledge.

 

So, I'm going to focus on what I know and CAN know. I'm going to ride that rollercoaster. I'm going to fly on that plane. I'm going to get involved in sociopolitical and religious discussions against idiots on the Internet. I'm going to possibly help subtitle Freeman's Mind episodes! I'm going to watch videos on Accursed Farms! I'm going to play the Black Mesa mod when it comes out! I'm going to get a job in computer animation! When life gives you lemons, don't make lemonade. Make life take the lemons back! Get mad! I don't want your damn lemons! What am I supposed to do with these?! Demand to see life's manager! Make life rue the day it thought it could give ME lemons! Do you know who I am? I'm the man who's gonna burn your house down! With the lemons! I'm gonna get my engineers to invent a combustible lemon that burns your house down!

 

.....oh, wait. Sorry.

 

Well, I remember I came to the conclusion that there is no purpose in life a long time ago, and we create it (Even with a deity, there is no purpose in life). But this just proves that evolutionists create their own human made common goal, "the betterment of our species" just as the other religions and aren't any more right in that way.

 

The second part of your post was pretty much use the freedom of life to the fullest.

With some rants which I don't care about.

 

Life seems to be a prison cell where you can do very little things compared to what you know, exists, and what can be done if you were outside that prison cell. Enjoy the prison cell then.

 

As for atheism being philosophically redundant, atheism is just as valid a belief as monotheism and polytheism with non religious monotheism being a little more popular along the philosophers.

 

And stop acting ridiculuous, noone tries to convert you to religion so you have some weird issues there constantly pushing it away.

[danielsangeo]

Sorry for the little off-the-rails "rant" portion... felt like Cave Johnson for a second there.

 

Also, atheism isn't a belief. It's a lack of a belief. As I keep saying.

 

Additionally, Jehovah's Witnesses and Mormons. I don't push religion away. I would love to be religious and believe in God and all that stuff, but I see no reason to believe.

[RoMaNo]

Quote from Romano: "However, I still remember what I wanted to say about beliefs. I say that science is a belief because its link with truth is not different with the link between truth and faith."

I would argue science is only a belief if you choose it to be, the laws of nature are indisputably laws of the nature we see and know of this physical reality. Science is based (mostly) upon deductive thinking whereas faith is more inductive. I don't think that's what you meant though, is it?

 

Well, when I say "link with truth" I mean with "absolute truth", that is, models of science are not absolute and we hope that work well and usually we are right because that models are very good due the deductive thinking involved in their conception. However, science with all its power, only provides models which are, in fact, simplifications of nature, they cannot be absolute truth, we must know that they will fail under some conditions and sometimes fail unexpectedly. To believe in science is also a faith act.

 

I dunno. I believe that you can be happy even if you're "smart" (though the more I learn, the stupider I oftentimes feel). I (in the same use as you use the word "I") don't feel like life is "shit". It's a gift from nature. I intend to enjoy my life as much as I can and I seek to leave the world better than I found it. It is through my arduous at self-education on a variety of subjects that I feel I can somehow distill all that I've learned and extend it to other people, in some vain attempt to "leave my mark" on others and, in turn, they can "leave their mark" with some sort of reference to my "mark" and someway contribute to the betterment of our species.

 

But that's probably my ego talking and it probably sounds rather pretentious but I don't care. It's how I feel.

 

(Well, shoot, now what do I do with my post?)

 

I really agree with your view. Maybe being a 'reference' has some ego, but I think that we should try to do our best, enjoy life, be honest, etc. We cannot change the world, but if we do well with people around us, we will put a small grain of sand to make this world a better place and that is the best that we can do.

 

Returning to beliefs, much of the debate is background wanting to be right, wanting to "win", that is human behaviour. Everyone has valid reasons to have their beliefs and we cannot underestimate people because of their beliefs.

[ProHypster]

Sorry for the little off-the-rails "rant" portion... felt like Cave Johnson for a second there.

 

Also, atheism isn't a belief. It's a lack of a belief. As I keep saying.

 

Additionally, Jehovah's Witnesses and Mormons. I don't push religion away. I would love to be religious and believe in God and all that stuff, but I see no reason to believe.

A lack of belief is a lack of belief, atheism specifically is a belief, if you lack a belief then you are an agnostic or you just don't position yourself at all. Atheism is a belief that there are no deities. And that is absolute.

[danielsangeo]

No. Atheism is the lack of belief. Agnosticism answers to a different question. Atheism is the lack of belief in deities. Some atheists might believe that there are no deities, but that's different from atheism.

[ProHypster]

No. Atheism is the lack of belief. Agnosticism answers to a different question. Atheism is the lack of belief in deities. Some atheists might believe that there are no deities, but that's different from atheism.

I disagree.

 

Atheism = A = No, Theism = Deity

 

So atheism = Belief in no deity, and agnosticism can be a religious position.

 

 

Agnosticism is the view that the truth value of certain claims—especially claims about the existence or non-existence of any deity, but also other religious and metaphysical claims—is unknown or unknowable

[Axeldeath]

Wrong, how can you "believe" there is no deity? That means a Christian is an Atheist also, they don't "believe" in Zeus. Everyone must be atheists, even agnostics because they "believe" that there may be a god.

[ProHypster]

Ah, crap the key word is deity and deities.

 

Well what the hell is the term for people believing in no deities

[danielsangeo]

Atheism is made of up three parts.

 

theos = God/deity

ism = suffix making former "belief"

 

Therefore theos+ism=Theism (belief in gods or deity or deities)

 

a = lack of

 

Therefore a+theism=atheism (lack of belief in god or deity or deities).

 

Agnosticism, meanwhile, deals with knowledge...or, specifically, the lack thereof.

 

Easy way to remember it:

"Do you believe in a god?" If Yes, then "theist" else "atheist".

"Do you know that god exists?" If Yes, then "gnostic" else "agnostic".

 

I am an agnostic atheist. I don't know and I don't believe.

 

I don't know the term (if there is one) for the belief there is no deities. Like I said, some atheists might believe there's no deities, but that's not atheism. I just don't know what it is.

 

Let's come up with one! Atheismism?

[ProHypster]

Atheism is made of up three parts.

 

theos = God/deity

ism = suffix making former "belief"

 

Therefore theos+ism=Theism (belief in gods or deity or deities)

 

a = lack of

 

Therefore a+theism=atheism (lack of belief in god or deity or deities).

 

Agnosticism, meanwhile, deals with knowledge...or, specifically, the lack thereof.

 

Easy way to remember it:

"Do you believe in a god?" If Yes, then "theist" else "atheist".

"Do you know that god exists?" If Yes, then "gnostic" else "agnostic".

 

I am an agnostic atheist. I don't know and I don't believe.

 

I don't know the term (if there is one) for the belief there is no deities. Like I said, some atheists might believe there's no deities, but that's not atheism. I just don't know what it is.

 

Let's come up with one! Atheismism?

 

No I believe properly in greek it would be apolytheism.

 

A doesn't mean lack of it means without in ancient greek. So atheism is actually "Belief without God"

 

Apolytheism would be then "belief without gods"

[Axeldeath]

Yeah, "a" as a prefix means without.

[Dan-95]

What i mean by the act of not believing is to reject. Does that clear it up?

 

Somewhere between ranting, i was mostly 'against' or talking in context of strong or explicit atheists. The kind of atheist that does not practice or have knowledge of god is what i consider bordering agnostic, thus, agnostic atheist statement. I guess the kind of non-practice or lack of knowledge, or understanding, lack of belief is what we've been arguing about(This would include things not yet aware of such situations, such as babies. I guess we just call this position of belief [Or lack thereof] different things.) . Looking back, i was probably to broad with my terms. And i'll admit, pretty much all of my previous posts are tired slurrs of ideas i have had, this post, however, was written at about 11pm, so it shouldn't be tainted by a more insomniac-like side. Now if you'll excuse me, i'll be waiting for the insanity to kick in...

 

If we still have something to argue about, do tell.

[Dan-95]

Also, looking through some posts, our definitions are a real clusterf*ck. Perhaps a clarification of broad terms in parentheses?

[ProHypster]

Also, looking through some posts, our definitions are a real clusterf*ck. Perhaps a clarification of broad terms in parentheses?

 

Guys, first of all let's clear this up with defintions so noone gets confused.

Correct me if you find me wrong.

 

Religion: Relates to the existence, nature, and worship of a deity or deities and divine involvement in the universe and human life

 

Theism: Belief in Deities/Deity

 

Monotheism: Belief in one deity

 

Polytheism: Belief in many deities.

 

Atheism: Relates to the disblief of Religion. There can be different atheists though.

 

Implicit Atheism: Position when a person has a Belief/Educated Guess that there is no deities

 

Explicit Atheism: Position when a person strongly rejects the existence of deities.

 

Agnosticism/Neutral Position: Relates to the position of a person when that believes that there is no decisive facts to both atheism and theism.

 

Apatheism: Same as above but also believes that the gods/god didn't do anything in the last 2000 years so even if it was proven they exist then it still wouldn't change anything.

 

Optimism: When one usually looks at the good side of something. One cup of coke is half-full.

 

Pessimism: When one usually sees the negative side of something. One cup of coke is half-empty.

 

Alright, so now let's hopefully see this thread using proper terminology unlike some others, hope I helped

 

Side note: Apolytheism would be belief without many gods not belief without gods.....

 

Plural word for God in greek is theoi but I wouldn't know how you would properly form the word:

 

Atheoism???

 

Ah, it doesn't matter for now. Let's just call it belief in no gods.

[danielsangeo]

Atheism is made of up three parts.

 

theos = God/deity

ism = suffix making former "belief"

 

Therefore theos+ism=Theism (belief in gods or deity or deities)

 

a = lack of

 

Therefore a+theism=atheism (lack of belief in god or deity or deities).

 

Agnosticism, meanwhile, deals with knowledge...or, specifically, the lack thereof.

 

Easy way to remember it:

"Do you believe in a god?" If Yes, then "theist" else "atheist".

"Do you know that god exists?" If Yes, then "gnostic" else "agnostic".

 

I am an agnostic atheist. I don't know and I don't believe.

 

I don't know the term (if there is one) for the belief there is no deities. Like I said, some atheists might believe there's no deities, but that's not atheism. I just don't know what it is.

 

Let's come up with one! Atheismism?

 

No I believe properly in greek it would be apolytheism.

 

A doesn't mean lack of it means without in ancient greek. So atheism is actually "Belief without God"

 

Actually, if "a" means 'without', then it's "without belief in god". A-theism. A, without. theism, belief in god.

 

Apolytheism would be then "belief without gods"

 

Actually, it would be "without belief in many gods".

 

The suffiix "ism" is applied to "theos", not 'a'. Aismthe? That sounds weird in my mouth.

[ProHypster]

Atheism is made of up three parts.

 

theos = God/deity

ism = suffix making former "belief"

 

Therefore theos+ism=Theism (belief in gods or deity or deities)

 

a = lack of

 

Therefore a+theism=atheism (lack of belief in god or deity or deities).

 

Agnosticism, meanwhile, deals with knowledge...or, specifically, the lack thereof.

 

Easy way to remember it:

"Do you believe in a god?" If Yes, then "theist" else "atheist".

"Do you know that god exists?" If Yes, then "gnostic" else "agnostic".

 

I am an agnostic atheist. I don't know and I don't believe.

 

I don't know the term (if there is one) for the belief there is no deities. Like I said, some atheists might believe there's no deities, but that's not atheism. I just don't know what it is.

 

Let's come up with one! Atheismism?

 

No I believe properly in greek it would be apolytheism.

 

A doesn't mean lack of it means without in ancient greek. So atheism is actually "Belief without God"

 

Actually, if "a" means 'without', then it's "without belief in god". A-theism. A, without. theism, belief in god.

 

Apolytheism would be then "belief without gods"

 

Actually, it would be "without belief in many gods".

 

The suffiix "ism" is applied to "theos", not 'a'. Aismthe? That sounds weird in my mouth.

 

Read last post, i said that I was mistaken and corrected it.

[danielsangeo]

For those that don't believe in God because they've never heard of Him, or don't believe in any gods because they've never heard of the concept are still atheists because they don't believe in gods. They are also agnostic because they don't know.

[Dan-95]

Agreed, therefore, atheist agnoticism. And what happened to your rep? Get into something controversial? +rep for you