Lybia and shit

[Ian]

Exactly..... Fuck NATO, I swear.

I can understand if you have strong emotions against NATO, but please try to convey them in a more constructive way.

 

NATO never claimed they killed him in the airstrike; they did suggest he may have been in the convoy they attacked.

[ThePest179]

Its just like Saddam. Hang him, Don't ask about all the shit he did...

 

Well he deserved it.

[expertyejin]

Its just like Saddam. Hang him, Don't ask about all the shit he did...

 

Well he deserved it.

Both Bush and Obama deserve to be hung too.

[ThePest179]

Its just like Saddam. Hang him, Don't ask about all the shit he did...

 

Well he deserved it.

Both Bush and Obama deserve to be hung too.

 

And why is that?

[BTGBullseye]

Obama yes, Bush no. If you actually look at the laws passed by the Democrats during Bush's presidency, you'll see an amazingly high percentage of them had enough votes to bypass a veto.

[ThePest179]

Obama yes, Bush no. If you actually look at the laws passed by the Democrats during Bush's presidency, you'll see an amazingly high percentage of them had enough votes to bypass a veto.

 

Let him answer. I want to know why he wants to hang Bush and Obama. And even if they made pretty shitty decisions, that does not warrant a death sentence.

Edited August 11, 2013 by Guest (see edit history)

[expertyejin]

Obama yes, Bush no. If you actually look at the laws passed by the Democrats during Bush's presidency, you'll see an amazingly high percentage of them had enough votes to bypass a veto.

 

Let him answer. I want to know why he wants to hang Bush and Obama.

Bush launched illegal wars, Obama's excessive use of unmanned drone has killed countless innocent children in the name of "war on terrorism". Both of them use the media to their own advantage, the media that covers up crimes committed by US soldiers against unarmed civilians but only reports on the fatalities of American soldiers, as if only American lives are important but the rest of the world are not!

 

And I'm not interested in hearing that "America is promoting freedom" trick. I don't buy it because it is clearly fake. If America really was a democracy then it wouldn't be desperately trying to arrest and silence whistle-blowers such as Edward Snowden. The saying "the truth hurts" exists, but "lies hurt" does not exist.

[expertyejin]

Americans who have never been outside of the US and only watch Fox News will never understand what I mean.

[BTGBullseye]

There is something seriously wrong with you...

 

First, the US congress wanted one person they could blame if the war didn't work out, so they gave the presidency full power to declare war. Considering that it was all because of 9/11, you can't blame him for declaring wars that the public was about to riot over.

 

Second, since the use of drones as the primary weapon system, civilian casualties have dropped by quite a lot... There are fewer innocent deaths from them per year than are caused by cars in the same country per month. (both Iraq and Afghanistan)

 

Third, I agree that every politician uses the mass media as their own personal PR campaign, but to what "crimes" are you referring? Can you provide any proof of them? (if you have some, I would be very willing to help make it public knowledge)

 

Fourth, the USA isn't a democracy... It's a democratic-republic... It's less about popularity than a straight-up democracy, but unfortunately the greedy people got in office and are doing what others tell them to for money. (instead of what they're supposed to do, for their salary of ~$174,000 and more for minority leaders)

 

Fifth, Snowden released classified information, technically that's called treason. By the laws of every country I can think of, he should be shot instead of tried. That he released information that our leaders were committing treasonous acts doesn't change that classified information was revealed that could affect national security negatively. My guess, if he gets caught soon, 30 years federal prison sentence. If he evades for too long, 50 years.

 

Sixth, Fox News is the closest to unbiased of any of the mass media news corporations, and is the only one that isn't outright pushing liberal propaganda. That being said, I don't even look at mass media any more... I get more information faster online, and I don't have to sit through commercials or get it pre-interpreted.

[Doom Shepherd]

I'm just amused by the idea of anybody in CHINA talking about countries with bad leaders. (And apparently, China has really crap media, too, if he actually believes that junk.)

[expertyejin]

There is something seriously wrong with you...

 

First, the US congress wanted one person they could blame if the war didn't work out, so they gave the presidency full power to declare war. Considering that it was all because of 9/11, you can't blame him for declaring wars that the public was about to riot over.

 

Second, since the use of drones as the primary weapon system, civilian casualties have dropped by quite a lot... There are fewer innocent deaths from them per year than are caused by cars in the same country per month. (both Iraq and Afghanistan)

 

Third, I agree that every politician uses the mass media as their own personal PR campaign, but to what "crimes" are you referring? Can you provide any proof of them? (if you have some, I would be very willing to help make it public knowledge)

 

Fourth, the USA isn't a democracy... It's a democratic-republic... It's less about popularity than a straight-up democracy, but unfortunately the greedy people got in office and are doing what others tell them to for money. (instead of what they're supposed to do, for their salary of ~$174,000 and more for minority leaders)

 

Fifth, Snowden released classified information, technically that's called treason. By the laws of every country I can think of, he should be shot instead of tried. That he released information that our leaders were committing treasonous acts doesn't change that classified information was revealed that could affect national security negatively. My guess, if he gets caught soon, 30 years federal prison sentence. If he evades for too long, 50 years.

 

Sixth, Fox News is the closest to unbiased of any of the mass media news corporations, and is the only one that isn't outright pushing liberal propaganda. That being said, I don't even look at mass media any more... I get more information faster online, and I don't have to sit through commercials or get it pre-interpreted.

 

First, this is a typical arrogant American school of thinking: only American lives matter because the US is one of the top superpowers. Americans are not even qualified to talk about 9/11 when your people dropped nuclear bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. 9/11 was a joke compared to that...

 

Second, you are just making up this bullshit about "civilian casualties have dropped by quite a lot" without solid evidence. Do you want me to give you a list of innocent children killed by unmanned drone strike?

 

Third, of course it is a crime to use the mass media to cover up crimes. Major news channels in the US may report on civilian casualties, but ONLY IF they are absolutely not concealable. And even with this in mind it has to be filtered by the government before being brought to public attention. Otherwise why would the US arrest Bradley Manning for releasing only a few videos showing US war crimes in Iraq?

 

Fourth, the Edward Snowden incident reveals how hypocritical the US government is - double standard all the time! Should he be a dissident from another country that fled to the US I'm 100% sure that your government would automatically accuse the country concerned of disrespecting human rights. Take for instance the Dalai Lama, prior to his exile he did have intimate contacts with the Chinese government. Thus he certainly is in possession of classified information concerning national security of China. Yet the US government is not advocating his arrest just because he is not a US dissident.

 

Fifth, there is something contradictory in your statement. Earlier on you said you were anti-Obama and anti-Democrat; however it's Obama who issued the arrest warrant of Snowden and you support him! Clearly you are speaking with prejudice rather than justice, because you only want Obama dead for harming people you like but you don't want him dead for people you dislike.

 

Sixth, you must be a government agent, because all ordinary American people I know (including many Conservatives) voiced their support for Snowden. You on the other hand support the NSA spying on your own people.

 

Seventh, technically there is no such thing as liberal or conservative. This idea came from the French Revolution when

the French aristocracy labelled the revolutionaries and rebels as liberals.

 

Eighth, you get more information faster online...yeah you only read information that you like.

[expertyejin]

I'm just amused by the idea of anybody in CHINA talking about countries with bad leaders. (And apparently, China has really crap media, too, if he actually believes that junk.)

I never said I am a fan of my government. Actually it's the US's fault if we have a communist dictatorship! The US supported & armed Chinese commies to overthrow the Nationalist government and take over mainland China in 1949.

[ThePest179]

Bush launched illegal wars, Obama's excessive use of unmanned drone has killed countless innocent children in the name of "war on terrorism". Both of them use the media to their own advantage, the media that covers up crimes committed by US soldiers against unarmed civilians but only reports on the fatalities of American soldiers, as if only American lives are important but the rest of the world are not!

 

And I'm not interested in hearing that "America is promoting freedom" trick. I don't buy it because it is clearly fake. If America really was a democracy then it wouldn't be desperately trying to arrest and silence whistle-blowers such as Edward Snowden. The saying "the truth hurts" exists, but "lies hurt" does not exist.

 

Now then, let me point out the flaws in your argument.

First, the drone strikes are not supposed to kill children (unless you believe the Nazis called al-Qaeda) and civilian deaths are accidental in nature.

Second, while the US media reports on only American fatalities, I have not seen any evidence of American soldiers committing war crimes of any kind in Afghanistan or Iraq.

Third, America may not always act like a DEMOCRATIC-REPUBLIC, that doesn't mean it is an evil empire trying to silence dissent.

[ThePest179]

First, the US congress wanted one person they could blame if the war didn't work out, so they gave the presidency full power to declare war. Considering that it was all because of 9/11, you can't blame him for declaring wars that the public was about to riot over.

Ironic considering that half way through the war the public wanted to stop fighting.

 

Third, I agree that every politician uses the mass media as their own personal PR campaign, but to what "crimes" are you referring? Can you provide any proof of them? (if you have some, I would be very willing to help make it public knowledge)

Makes me shudder to think what connections you have, Bullseye.

 

Fifth, Snowden released classified information, technically that's called treason. By the laws of every country I can think of, he should be shot instead of tried. That he released information that our leaders were committing treasonous acts doesn't change that classified information was revealed that could affect national security negatively. My guess, if he gets caught soon, 30 years federal prison sentence. If he evades for too long, 50 years.

Which is sad all thing considering, but if you don't enforce the law, it bites you in the ass later on.

 

First, this is a typical arrogant American school of thinking: only American lives matter because the US is one of the top superpowers. Americans are not even qualified to talk about 9/11 when your people dropped nuclear bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. 9/11 was a joke compared to that...

Did he say only American lives mattered!? He didn't once say that! And if the US didn't atom bomb Japan, the number of dead on both sides would have been overwhelming.

 

Second, you are just making up this bullshit about "civilian casualties have dropped by quite a lot" without solid evidence. Do you want me to give you a list of innocent children killed by unmanned drone strike?

Yes, please give me the list of children that don't exist that were killed in these strikes.

 

Third, of course it is a crime to use the mass media to cover up crimes. Major news channels in the US may report on civilian casualties, but ONLY IF they are absolutely not concealable. And even with this in mind it has to be filtered by the government before being brought to public attention. Otherwise why would the US arrest Bradley Manning for releasing only a few videos showing US war crimes in Iraq?

What are you talking about?! Are you actually suggesting that the US government AND media outlets are covering up war crimes in the War on Terror?! Let me use the Vietnam War as my example. Almost every atrocity committed by US forces were reported in detail when they happened. Why should it be different now?

 

Fourth, the Edward Snowden incident reveals how hypocritical the US government is - double standard all the time! Should he be a dissident from another country that fled to the US I'm 100% sure that your government would automatically accuse the country concerned of disrespecting human rights. Take for instance the Dalai Lama, prior to his exile he did have intimate contacts with the Chinese government. Thus he certainly is in possession of classified information concerning national security of China. Yet the US government is not advocating his arrest just because he is not a US dissident.

You're really comparing the example of a person who fled communist oppression to a person who revealed major elements in a counter-terror operation that helps them thwart terrorist operations? I don't think I have to go into detail here.

 

Fifth, there is something contradictory in your statement. Earlier on you said you were anti-Obama and anti-Democrat; however it's Obama who issued the arrest warrant of Snowden and you support him! Clearly you are speaking with prejudice rather than justice, because you only want Obama dead for harming people you like but you don't want him dead for people you dislike.

Views can change. Understood?

 

Sixth, you must be a government agent, because all ordinary American people I know (including many Conservatives) voiced their support for Snowden. You on the other hand support the NSA spying on your own people.

Wrong. Dead wrong. 80% of the senators on Fox news want to imprison Snowden, and my friends are split 50-50 on Snowden.

 

Seventh, technically there is no such thing as liberal or conservative. This idea came from the French Revolution when

the French aristocracy labelled the revolutionaries and rebels as liberals.

No, you do not want to acknowledge that there are such things is all. And didn't you just say you knew some conservatives?

 

Eighth, you get more information faster online...yeah you only read information that you like.

Excuse me, but I have RARELY seen BTGBullseye wrong when I have argued with him. We may not agree on everything, but he knows what he's talking about.

Edited August 12, 2013 by Guest (see edit history)

[ThePest179]

I never said I am a fan of my government. Actually it's the US's fault if we have a communist dictatorship! The US supported & armed Chinese commies to overthrow the Nationalist government and take over mainland China in 1949.

 

WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT!?!?!? Trust me when I say I know what the US did to persecute communists during the 1940's and 50's. So why would a very anti-communist government arm communist rebels in the MOST POPULATED COUNTRY IN ASIA!?!? Well what's the answer?

[expertyejin]

Bush launched illegal wars, Obama's excessive use of unmanned drone has killed countless innocent children in the name of "war on terrorism". Both of them use the media to their own advantage, the media that covers up crimes committed by US soldiers against unarmed civilians but only reports on the fatalities of American soldiers, as if only American lives are important but the rest of the world are not!

 

And I'm not interested in hearing that "America is promoting freedom" trick. I don't buy it because it is clearly fake. If America really was a democracy then it wouldn't be desperately trying to arrest and silence whistle-blowers such as Edward Snowden. The saying "the truth hurts" exists, but "lies hurt" does not exist.

 

Now then, let me point out the flaws in your argument.

First, the drone strikes are not supposed to kill children (unless you believe the Nazis called al-Qaeda) and civilian deaths are accidental in nature.

Second, while the US media reports on only American fatalities, I have not seen any evidence of American soldiers committing war crimes of any kind in Afghanistan or Iraq.

Third, America may not always act like a DEMOCRATIC-REPUBLIC, that doesn't mean it is an evil empire trying to silence dissent.

First, it's true the drone strikes are not supposed to kill children; yet fact remains that the military did deliberately and randomly choose targets which led to the killing of children. And if you are unable to see evidence of US war crimes that's because you choose to believe the fascist US mainstream media.

Second, actually America really is trying to silence dissidents (Bradley Manning, Edward Snowden, Julian Assange...)

[expertyejin]

First, the US congress wanted one person they could blame if the war didn't work out, so they gave the presidency full power to declare war. Considering that it was all because of 9/11, you can't blame him for declaring wars that the public was about to riot over.

Ironic considering that half way through the war the public wanted to stop fighting.

 

Third, I agree that every politician uses the mass media as their own personal PR campaign, but to what "crimes" are you referring? Can you provide any proof of them? (if you have some, I would be very willing to help make it public knowledge)

Makes me shudder to think what connections you have, Bullseye.

 

Fifth, Snowden released classified information, technically that's called treason. By the laws of every country I can think of, he should be shot instead of tried. That he released information that our leaders were committing treasonous acts doesn't change that classified information was revealed that could affect national security negatively. My guess, if he gets caught soon, 30 years federal prison sentence. If he evades for too long, 50 years.

Which is sad all thing considering, but if you don't enforce the law, it bites you in the ass later on.

 

First, this is a typical arrogant American school of thinking: only American lives matter because the US is one of the top superpowers. Americans are not even qualified to talk about 9/11 when your people dropped nuclear bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. 9/11 was a joke compared to that...

Did he say only American lives mattered!? He didn't once say that! And if the US didn't atom bomb Japan, the number of dead on both sides would have been overwhelming.

You have no idea of how Palestinians are suffering daily under the Israeli occupation - their homes have been demolished, relatives killed by the IDF. Yet, those who worked in the Twin Towers were henchmen of the Zionist regime by being a major force in boosting the US economy hence financing your government which in turn uses it to support Israel in developing deadlier weapons to slay more innocent Palestinians. Bin Laden is VERY rich, he could've chosen to unite Mujaheddin from around the world & destroy Israel; yet he spared Israel and chose instead to dismantle the WTC. By doing so not only had Israel's nuclear development been delayed as a result of 9/11, merely 3000 people died rather than costing the lives of several million Israelis+Palestinians. Al Qaeda has been fighting against the West for year yet they've NEVER fought a single war against Israel. This is truth!

Second, you are just making up this bullshit about "civilian casualties have dropped by quite a lot" without solid evidence. Do you want me to give you a list of innocent children killed by unmanned drone strike?

Yes, please give me the list of children that don't exist that were killed in these strikes.

Here is the list:

http://topinfopost.com/2013/07/25/a-list-of-children-killed-by-drone-strikes-in-pakistan-and-yemen?fb_source=pubv1

Third, of course it is a crime to use the mass media to cover up crimes. Major news channels in the US may report on civilian casualties, but ONLY IF they are absolutely not concealable. And even with this in mind it has to be filtered by the government before being brought to public attention. Otherwise why would the US arrest Bradley Manning for releasing only a few videos showing US war crimes in Iraq?

What are you talking about?! Are you actually suggesting that the US government AND media outlets are covering up war crimes in the War on Terror?! Let me use the Vietnam War as my example. Almost every atrocity committed by US forces were reported in detail when they happened. Why should it be different now?

That's because they were not concealable! Read carefully what I wrote!

Fourth, the Edward Snowden incident reveals how hypocritical the US government is - double standard all the time! Should he be a dissident from another country that fled to the US I'm 100% sure that your government would automatically accuse the country concerned of disrespecting human rights. Take for instance the Dalai Lama, prior to his exile he did have intimate contacts with the Chinese government. Thus he certainly is in possession of classified information concerning national security of China. Yet the US government is not advocating his arrest just because he is not a US dissident.

You're really comparing the example of a person who fled communist oppression to a person who revealed major elements in a counter-terror operation that helps them thwart terrorist operations? I don't think I have to go into detail here.

Euh, so you are basically saying all civilians are terrorists and need to be spied upon? Give me a break! And I don't believe in American fake democracy, as it only benefits White people! America has been oppressing Black people for years, and Obama got elected only because he grew up in a White neighborhood. Only White people get fair trial in the US, that's why the police officer who fatally shot Trayvon Martin could get away with it.

Fifth, there is something contradictory in your statement. Earlier on you said you were anti-Obama and anti-Democrat; however it's Obama who issued the arrest warrant of Snowden and you support him! Clearly you are speaking with prejudice rather than justice, because you only want Obama dead for harming people you like but you don't want him dead for people you dislike.

Views can change. Understood?

 

Sixth, you must be a government agent, because all ordinary American people I know (including many Conservatives) voiced their support for Snowden. You on the other hand support the NSA spying on your own people.

Wrong. Dead wrong. 80% of the senators on Fox news want to imprison Snowden, and my friends are split 50-50 on Snowden.

I'm not talking about politicians I'm rather referring to ordinary people, and quite a handful of your friends might well be government officials.

Seventh, technically there is no such thing as liberal or conservative. This idea came from the French Revolution when

the French aristocracy labelled the revolutionaries and rebels as liberals.

No, you do not want to acknowledge that there are such things is all. And didn't you just say you knew some conservatives?

I said "conservatives" only to enlighten him from his perspective of how society works, but still you can check out this historical fact about being liberal/conservative and you'll see I'm right.

Eighth, you get more information faster online...yeah you only read information that you like.

Excuse me, but I have RARELY seen BTGBullseye wrong when I have argued with him. We may not agree on everything, but he knows what he's talking about.

[expertyejin]

I never said I am a fan of my government. Actually it's the US's fault if we have a communist dictatorship! The US supported & armed Chinese commies to overthrow the Nationalist government and take over mainland China in 1949.

 

WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT!?!?!? Trust me when I say I know what the US did to persecute communists during the 1940's and 50's. So why would a very anti-communist government arm communist rebels in the MOST POPULATED COUNTRY IN ASIA!?!? Well what's the answer?

You are denying the fact the US supported communists? Well even after communist takeover of China the US attempted on several occasions to assassinate the nationalist leader. It's my country's history so I know it! Plus let's talk about the USSR instead, as it is better known to the world. While Nazi Germany only killed 6 million people, Soviet Russia alone murdered 60 million people! And America chose to side with the most evil out of the two!

[BTGBullseye]

First, this is a typical arrogant American school of thinking: only American lives matter because the US is one of the top superpowers. Americans are not even qualified to talk about 9/11 when your people dropped nuclear bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. 9/11 was a joke compared to that...

Did he say only American lives mattered!? He didn't once say that! And if the US didn't atom bomb Japan, the number of dead on both sides would have been overwhelming.

You have no idea of how Palestinians are suffering daily under the Israeli occupation - their homes have been demolished, relatives killed by the IDF. Yet, those who worked in the Twin Towers were henchmen of the Zionist regime by being a major force in boosting the US economy hence financing your government which in turn uses it to support Israel in developing deadlier weapons to slay more innocent Palestinians. Bin Laden is VERY rich, he could've chosen to unite Mujaheddin from around the world & destroy Israel; yet he spared Israel and chose instead to dismantle the WTC. By doing so not only had Israel's nuclear development been delayed as a result of 9/11, merely 3000 people died rather than costing the lives of several million Israelis+Palestinians. Al Qaeda has been fighting against the West for year yet they've NEVER fought a single war against Israel. This is truth!

First, Osama was not that rich. Grand total funding throughout the entire organization was less than $10 million US.

Second, Israel has had a supply of tactical nukes since the 60's. (a gift from the US to use as a deterrent against invasion)

Third, what does 9/11 have to do with Israel? Have you any proof of the connections you keep touting?

Fourth, the Palestinians are trying to invade Israel, and committing large numbers of terrorist attacks toward that end. (I remember one big one from last year was a child carrying a suicide bomb to the Wailing Wall)

Fifth, Al Qaeda was formed to combat "western ideals", which Israel doesn't actually share, so why would Israel be targeted?

 

Second, you are just making up this bullshit about "civilian casualties have dropped by quite a lot" without solid evidence. Do you want me to give you a list of innocent children killed by unmanned drone strike?

Yes, please give me the list of children that don't exist that were killed in these strikes.

Here is the list:

http://topinfopost.com/2013/07/25/a-list-of-children-killed-by-drone-strikes-in-pakistan-and-yemen?fb_source=pubv1

Thank you for linking to a list of less than 50 children... That many dead from the entire conflict, and yet far more than that die from car related incidents in the same countries. You just helped prove my point. (I'm not going to bother posting the links to the various Wiki pages that support my claims, especially since they show up in a simple search on the subject [once you get around all the war related crap])

 

Third, of course it is a crime to use the mass media to cover up crimes. Major news channels in the US may report on civilian casualties, but ONLY IF they are absolutely not concealable. And even with this in mind it has to be filtered by the government before being brought to public attention. Otherwise why would the US arrest Bradley Manning for releasing only a few videos showing US war crimes in Iraq?

What are you talking about?! Are you actually suggesting that the US government AND media outlets are covering up war crimes in the War on Terror?! Let me use the Vietnam War as my example. Almost every atrocity committed by US forces were reported in detail when they happened. Why should it be different now?

That's because they were not concealable! Read carefully what I wrote!

So, where's your evidence of other crimes? I already told you I would help make them public knowledge if you had evidence.

 

Fourth, the Edward Snowden incident reveals how hypocritical the US government is - double standard all the time! Should he be a dissident from another country that fled to the US I'm 100% sure that your government would automatically accuse the country concerned of disrespecting human rights. Take for instance the Dalai Lama, prior to his exile he did have intimate contacts with the Chinese government. Thus he certainly is in possession of classified information concerning national security of China. Yet the US government is not advocating his arrest just because he is not a US dissident.

You're really comparing the example of a person who fled communist oppression to a person who revealed major elements in a counter-terror operation that helps them thwart terrorist operations? I don't think I have to go into detail here.

Euh, so you are basically saying all civilians are terrorists and need to be spied upon? Give me a break! And I don't believe in American fake democracy, as it only benefits White people! America has been oppressing Black people for years, and Obama got elected only because he grew up in a White neighborhood. Only White people get fair trial in the US, that's why the police officer who fatally shot Trayvon Martin could get away with it.

You're switching subjects faster than a US politician talking about his sex life... Stick with a topic, provide something that either supports your position or disproves someone else's. If you don't, you're trolling, and will end up with a ban if you aren't careful.

 

Concerning the racism mini-topic, blacks are the most prejudiced, and whites the least. (interestingly enough, that's a quote from a black guy I knew in high school) There are even laws in place making it easier for everyone except whites to get higher paying jobs, or public office. (it's one of the reasons that I'm not a professional in the computer industry right now, a black guy with no experience beats a white guy that has more experience than all the other employees in the company put together)

 

Sixth, you must be a government agent, because all ordinary American people I know (including many Conservatives) voiced their support for Snowden. You on the other hand support the NSA spying on your own people.

Wrong. Dead wrong. 80% of the senators on Fox news want to imprison Snowden, and my friends are split 50-50 on Snowden.

I'm not talking about politicians I'm rather referring to ordinary people, and quite a handful of your friends might well be government officials.

Speculating on his choice of friends says nothing about the validity of your claims.

 

Some of Snowden's actions (like revealing that the government was violating the US constitution, and providing proof) I support, while others (like releasing information to other countries about classified communication techniques) I condemn. One right doesn't fix the wrongs, and he should be punished for the wrongs. (doesn't matter what political affiliation you are, logic is logic)

 

Seventh, technically there is no such thing as liberal or conservative. This idea came from the French Revolution when

the French aristocracy labelled the revolutionaries and rebels as liberals.

No, you do not want to acknowledge that there are such things is all. And didn't you just say you knew some conservatives?

I said "conservatives" only to enlighten him from his perspective of how society works, but still you can check out this historical fact about being liberal/conservative and you'll see I'm right.

Where? Why? What does it have to do with anything? Etc?

 

I never said I am a fan of my government. Actually it's the US's fault if we have a communist dictatorship! The US supported & armed Chinese commies to overthrow the Nationalist government and take over mainland China in 1949.

WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT!?!?!? Trust me when I say I know what the US did to persecute communists during the 1940's and 50's. So why would a very anti-communist government arm communist rebels in the MOST POPULATED COUNTRY IN ASIA!?!? Well what's the answer?

You are denying the fact the US supported communists? Well even after communist takeover of China the US attempted on several occasions to assassinate the nationalist leader. It's my country's history so I know it! Plus let's talk about the USSR instead, as it is better known to the world. While Nazi Germany only killed 6 million people, Soviet Russia alone murdered 60 million people! And America chose to side with the most evil out of the two!

The Communist party in China has a long history of rewriting the history to suit their purposes. (find the info yourself, it's 3AM here and I'm too tired to bother)

 

Bush launched illegal wars, Obama's excessive use of unmanned drone has killed countless innocent children in the name of "war on terrorism". Both of them use the media to their own advantage, the media that covers up crimes committed by US soldiers against unarmed civilians but only reports on the fatalities of American soldiers, as if only American lives are important but the rest of the world are not!

 

And I'm not interested in hearing that "America is promoting freedom" trick. I don't buy it because it is clearly fake. If America really was a democracy then it wouldn't be desperately trying to arrest and silence whistle-blowers such as Edward Snowden. The saying "the truth hurts" exists, but "lies hurt" does not exist.

Now then, let me point out the flaws in your argument.

First, the drone strikes are not supposed to kill children (unless you believe the Nazis called al-Qaeda) and civilian deaths are accidental in nature.

Second, while the US media reports on only American fatalities, I have not seen any evidence of American soldiers committing war crimes of any kind in Afghanistan or Iraq.

Third, America may not always act like a DEMOCRATIC-REPUBLIC, that doesn't mean it is an evil empire trying to silence dissent.

First, it's true the drone strikes are not supposed to kill children; yet fact remains that the military did deliberately and randomly choose targets which led to the killing of children. And if you are unable to see evidence of US war crimes that's because you choose to believe the fascist US mainstream media.

Second, actually America really is trying to silence dissidents (Bradley Manning, Edward Snowden, Julian Assange...)

Where is your proof of that "fact"? I have seen and heard from the people that actually fly those missions plenty of information opposing your "fact".

Two US citizens who committed treasonous acts, and one Australian citizen who made a file sharing site that hosted anything anyone put there... Where are you getting this list of "dissidents"?

[expertyejin]

First, this is a typical arrogant American school of thinking: only American lives matter because the US is one of the top superpowers. Americans are not even qualified to talk about 9/11 when your people dropped nuclear bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. 9/11 was a joke compared to that...

Did he say only American lives mattered!? He didn't once say that! And if the US didn't atom bomb Japan, the number of dead on both sides would have been overwhelming.

You have no idea of how Palestinians are suffering daily under the Israeli occupation - their homes have been demolished, relatives killed by the IDF. Yet, those who worked in the Twin Towers were henchmen of the Zionist regime by being a major force in boosting the US economy hence financing your government which in turn uses it to support Israel in developing deadlier weapons to slay more innocent Palestinians. Bin Laden is VERY rich, he could've chosen to unite Mujaheddin from around the world & destroy Israel; yet he spared Israel and chose instead to dismantle the WTC. By doing so not only had Israel's nuclear development been delayed as a result of 9/11, merely 3000 people died rather than costing the lives of several million Israelis+Palestinians. Al Qaeda has been fighting against the West for year yet they've NEVER fought a single war against Israel. This is truth!

First, Osama was not that rich. Grand total funding throughout the entire organization was less than $10 million US.

Second, Israel has had a supply of tactical nukes since the 60's. (a gift from the US to use as a deterrent against invasion)

Third, what does 9/11 have to do with Israel? Have you any proof of the connections you keep touting?

Fourth, the Palestinians are trying to invade Israel, and committing large numbers of terrorist attacks toward that end. (I remember one big one from last year was a child carrying a suicide bomb to the Wailing Wall)

Fifth, Al Qaeda was formed to combat "western ideals", which Israel doesn't actually share, so why would Israel be targeted?

First, you are making up this lie about Osama's "total assets worth less than $10 million" without solid proof. Yes he was rich, he was richer than any Middle Eastern government! His family still owns poppy fields which produce morphine, a vital ingredient in the making of cocaine that can be found in the very popular soft drink Coca Cola!

Second, you are obviously only sitting in your comfortable sofa and brainwashed by your mainstream media. Of course 9/11 has everything to do with Israel. A large portion of the US economy that your government used to fund those criminal Zionists came from the Twin Towers. He was also pissed about biased American policy towards Israel despite the fact Israel has already betrayed America several times and is still doing so.

Third, Israel is considered a Western country, hence "western ideals" do apply here.

Fourth, Zionists in Israel are colonizers, they are not even true descendants of Israelites. The ancient Israelites were of WEST ASIAN RACE WITH TAN SKIN; however, the vast majority of those Zionists are White Europeans who colonized Palestine in 1948, not Middle Easterners at all. Plus there were Jews in Palestine before Israel was created, they are real Mizrahi Jews. You can even Youtube "Jews and Muslims were living in peace before the creation of Israel".

Fifth, if you are a real Republican/Conservative then you should support Palestine rather than Israel, because back in 1948 Britain, which is supposed to be an US ally supported Palestine while Soviet Russia supported Israel. The US however, chose to side with the USSR and supported Israel (aha, another evidence the US supported communists!) Why? Because at that time the US president who supported Israel was Harry Truman, a DEMOCRAT!

Second, you are just making up this bullshit about "civilian casualties have dropped by quite a lot" without solid evidence. Do you want me to give you a list of innocent children killed by unmanned drone strike?

Yes, please give me the list of children that don't exist that were killed in these strikes.

Here is the list:

http://topinfopost.com/2013/07/25/a-list-of-children-killed-by-drone-strikes-in-pakistan-and-yemen?fb_source=pubv1

Thank you for linking to a list of less than 50 children... That many dead from the entire conflict, and yet far more than that die from car related incidents in the same countries. You just helped prove my point. (I'm not going to bother posting the links to the various Wiki pages that support my claims, especially since they show up in a simple search on the subject [once you get around all the war related crap])

Dude, if you say that, that's because either you did not count at all, or there is something seriously wrong with your IQ! This list alone mentions the death of over 100 children, and I counted. Not to mention this is only a tip of the iceberg! And I'm not going to bother posting the links to the various webpages that support my claims either...

Third, of course it is a crime to use the mass media to cover up crimes. Major news channels in the US may report on civilian casualties, but ONLY IF they are absolutely not concealable. And even with this in mind it has to be filtered by the government before being brought to public attention. Otherwise why would the US arrest Bradley Manning for releasing only a few videos showing US war crimes in Iraq?

What are you talking about?! Are you actually suggesting that the US government AND media outlets are covering up war crimes in the War on Terror?! Let me use the Vietnam War as my example. Almost every atrocity committed by US forces were reported in detail when they happened. Why should it be different now?

That's because they were not concealable! Read carefully what I wrote!

So, where's your evidence of other crimes? I already told you I would help make them public knowledge if you had evidence.

Do you even need to ask? Technology is always advancing, and unlike today, there was no Photoshop and other stuff at that time to cover up and filter war crimes and related information.

Fourth, the Edward Snowden incident reveals how hypocritical the US government is - double standard all the time! Should he be a dissident from another country that fled to the US I'm 100% sure that your government would automatically accuse the country concerned of disrespecting human rights. Take for instance the Dalai Lama, prior to his exile he did have intimate contacts with the Chinese government. Thus he certainly is in possession of classified information concerning national security of China. Yet the US government is not advocating his arrest just because he is not a US dissident.

You're really comparing the example of a person who fled communist oppression to a person who revealed major elements in a counter-terror operation that helps them thwart terrorist operations? I don't think I have to go into detail here.

Euh, so you are basically saying all civilians are terrorists and need to be spied upon? Give me a break! And I don't believe in American fake democracy, as it only benefits White people! America has been oppressing Black people for years, and Obama got elected only because he grew up in a White neighborhood. Only White people get fair trial in the US, that's why the police officer who fatally shot Trayvon Martin could get away with it.

You're switching subjects faster than a US politician talking about his sex life... Stick with a topic, provide something that either supports your position or disproves someone else's. If you don't, you're trolling, and will end up with a ban if you aren't careful.

 

Concerning the racism mini-topic, blacks are the most prejudiced, and whites the least. (interestingly enough, that's a quote from a black guy I knew in high school) There are even laws in place making it easier for everyone except whites to get higher paying jobs, or public office. (it's one of the reasons that I'm not a professional in the computer industry right now, a black guy with no experience beats a white guy that has more experience than all the other employees in the company put together)

You may very well be a racist against Blacks yourself, and that Black guy you "met in high school" might be in your imagination. The US government has a history of hiring KKK members to slaughter black people, and incidents pertaining to White policemen who, motivated by racism fatally shot Black people do occur. You cannot deny this.

Sixth, you must be a government agent, because all ordinary American people I know (including many Conservatives) voiced their support for Snowden. You on the other hand support the NSA spying on your own people.

Wrong. Dead wrong. 80% of the senators on Fox news want to imprison Snowden, and my friends are split 50-50 on Snowden.

I'm not talking about politicians I'm rather referring to ordinary people, and quite a handful of your friends might well be government officials.

Speculating on his choice of friends says nothing about the validity of your claims.

 

Some of Snowden's actions (like revealing that the government was violating the US constitution, and providing proof) I support, while others (like releasing information to other countries about classified communication techniques) I condemn. One right doesn't fix the wrongs, and he should be punished for the wrongs. (doesn't matter what political affiliation you are, logic is logic)

Wrong! Snowden never released any information to other countries, and even Republican Ron Paul supports this claim.

And if you seriously think government officials represent the people then you are deeply brainwashed, given the fact all of them are corrupted as each and every one of them is leading a luxurious life inside their awfully expensive real estate whereas many taxpayers are literally working to death to pay these greedy politicians.

Seventh, technically there is no such thing as liberal or conservative. This idea came from the French Revolution when

the French aristocracy labelled the revolutionaries and rebels as liberals.

No, you do not want to acknowledge that there are such things is all. And didn't you just say you knew some conservatives?

I said "conservatives" only to enlighten him from his perspective of how society works, but still you can check out this historical fact about being liberal/conservative and you'll see I'm right.

Where? Why? What does it have to do with anything? Etc?

Dude go check out for yourself if you've never learned this from your history class. I'm saying "Democrat/Republican" just to make you understand my take from your perspective, but in reality nobody is supposed to be labelled as liberal/conservative.

I never said I am a fan of my government. Actually it's the US's fault if we have a communist dictatorship! The US supported & armed Chinese commies to overthrow the Nationalist government and take over mainland China in 1949.

WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT!?!?!? Trust me when I say I know what the US did to persecute communists during the 1940's and 50's. So why would a very anti-communist government arm communist rebels in the MOST POPULATED COUNTRY IN ASIA!?!? Well what's the answer?

You are denying the fact the US supported communists? Well even after communist takeover of China the US attempted on several occasions to assassinate the nationalist leader. It's my country's history so I know it! Plus let's talk about the USSR instead, as it is better known to the world. While Nazi Germany only killed 6 million people, Soviet Russia alone murdered 60 million people! And America chose to side with the most evil out of the two!

The Communist party in China has a long history of rewriting the history to suit their purposes. (find the info yourself, it's 3AM here and I'm too tired to bother)

I am not saying this based on communist propaganda, I do my own research. In fact they don't even teach us this in our history books. After all, while we have to manage to break through the firewall used by our government to censor information in order to seek truth, you on the other hand are just like some other Americans who are fed up with government-filtered information despite the fact you are enjoying the relative freedom of online surfing. Isn't this ironic?!

Bush launched illegal wars, Obama's excessive use of unmanned drone has killed countless innocent children in the name of "war on terrorism". Both of them use the media to their own advantage, the media that covers up crimes committed by US soldiers against unarmed civilians but only reports on the fatalities of American soldiers, as if only American lives are important but the rest of the world are not!

 

And I'm not interested in hearing that "America is promoting freedom" trick. I don't buy it because it is clearly fake. If America really was a democracy then it wouldn't be desperately trying to arrest and silence whistle-blowers such as Edward Snowden. The saying "the truth hurts" exists, but "lies hurt" does not exist.

Now then, let me point out the flaws in your argument.

First, the drone strikes are not supposed to kill children (unless you believe the Nazis called al-Qaeda) and civilian deaths are accidental in nature.

Second, while the US media reports on only American fatalities, I have not seen any evidence of American soldiers committing war crimes of any kind in Afghanistan or Iraq.

Third, America may not always act like a DEMOCRATIC-REPUBLIC, that doesn't mean it is an evil empire trying to silence dissent.

First, it's true the drone strikes are not supposed to kill children; yet fact remains that the military did deliberately and randomly choose targets which led to the killing of children. And if you are unable to see evidence of US war crimes that's because you choose to believe the fascist US mainstream media.

Second, actually America really is trying to silence dissidents (Bradley Manning, Edward Snowden, Julian Assange...)

Where is your proof of that "fact"? I have seen and heard from the people that actually fly those missions plenty of information opposing your "fact".

Two US citizens who committed treasonous acts, and one Australian citizen who made a file sharing site that hosted anything anyone put there... Where are you getting this list of "dissidents"?

You just proved my point (only American lives matter because the US is one of the top superpowers). You think Manning is a traitor simply because he leaked information on US war crimes against unarmed Iraqis. If it were the other way around (that he revealed killing of US soldiers by insurgents), then I'm 100% sure you'd be protesting against your government.

 

Julian Assange is exposing governments from every country, yet only the US and its puppets have problem with it. Isn't this enough to prove that American democracy is a joke?