Iraqi civil war.

[ThePest179]

That's what I'm saying... It's the few that do (and the average is as I put it, extremely few and far between at younger ages, more common in the older crowd) that are keeping the world from massive wars over piddly shit.

 

I really don't give half an ass, I'm saying this thread got horribly derailed, and you should get back on topic.

[Doom Shepherd]

Your evidence is Star Trek and Lord of the Flies? SERIOUSLY? You're using FICTION to back up an argument on human psychology? Because I'll tell you straight-out that if humans were as you described WE WOULD ALL BE FUCKING DEAD. Nature is pretty unforgiving, and if we really were the stupid, impulsive louts you describe we would NEVER have survived. We survived in a harsh environment for HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF FUCKING YEARS with NO technology, NO medicine and NO education, because we are SMART, CAPABLE and generally able to look out for our own well-being. THAT IS THE ONLY REASON WE EXIST.

 

You use all caps a lot. It's a sign of anger. Which is a sign of weakness. Anger makes you stupid.

 

And then you start thinking you're Ra's al Ghul.

 

Ra's al Ghul is an international criminal mastermind whose ultimate goal is a world in perfect balance. He believes that the best way to achieve this balance is to eliminate most of humanity. Ra's usually tries to assault the world's human populace with a biological weapon, such as a genetically-engineered virus.

 

Yeah, that's right. You're a fucking comic book villain.

 

And I'm the Goddamn Batman.

[Seattleite]

Fuck this thread. First it got de-railed, then we've got blatant falsehoods and non-logic, and now Doom Shepard is going on about DC Comics. I'm out.

[Doom Shepherd]

Houston, we have a successful burn.

[Seattleite]

Houston, we have a verified troll.

[BTGBullseye]

And you just don't know when to stop.

[ThePest179]

And you just don't know when to stop.

 

So false it physically hurts. Get on topic.

[BTGBullseye]

How about you do so as well instead of trying to insult someone.

[ThePest179]

How about you do so as well instead of trying to insult someone.

 

That was an insult? In any case I see three reasons why the damn discussion went off the rails, and you're one of them. YOU can get off if you don't actually want to add to the discussion though.

 

OT:http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/transport/10994794/Emirates-to-stop-flying-over-Iraq-due-to-missile-risk.html

[BTGBullseye]

I said attempted insult... That means that it was unsuccessful. I may have been a point in the derailment, but I wasn't one of the people who pulled out a section of the track.

 

http://www.snopes.com/photos/military/sandplanes.asp

 

Has anyone considered what would happen if there is another location like this, and one of the factions stumbles across it?

[ThePest179]

http://www.snopes.com/photos/military/sandplanes.asp

 

Has anyone considered what would happen if there is another location like this, and one of the factions stumbles across it?

 

The question is WHO would them? If the Iraqis/Iranians get those, they can't do too much considering Iran has better quality aircraft. If ISIS gets them, there's no point, as they have no pilots and those planes probably aren't going to be up to code against Iranian/Russian planes. Probably best if they're sold for scrap.

 

This all assumes, of course, that there are more out there. That is unlikely.

[BTGBullseye]

Well, I have had friends that have driven around out there who said it wouldn't surprise them if another field of those planes turned up in a couple years... That's why I mention it.

 

Also, just because they're old, it doesn't mean they can't be used to a great effect. Those Foxbats can outrun most of the modern fighters, and if they have a standard load of countermeasures, would easily be able to do a hit-and-run attack on just about anywhere. Also, pilots are easy to train for those kind of missions. (basics of the the systems, then a few days doing a flight sim game, and put them in the cockpit for a week, and they'll figure it out if they're intelligent)

[ThePest179]

Except there's also the process of cleaning out all the sand in it, and hiding it effectively (public areas won't work because an Iranian/Iraqi pilot won't give a shit). Once the planes are known to ISIS's enemies, they will almost definitely try their best to find and destroy it. And then there's also fuel and maintenance, and ISIS would probably want lots of men at the front instead of working on a plane that will probably get shot down.

[BTGBullseye]

You never know, but they were also buried with munitions, so what about that aspect? A few hundred 1000lb bombs would be fairly devastating if modified to be carried by a rocket.

[ThePest179]

You never know, but they were also buried with munitions, so what about that aspect? A few hundred 1000lb bombs would be fairly devastating if modified to be carried by a rocket.

 

Screw the rocket, they could divide that into suicide and car bombs (both of which still haunt Bagdad).

[BTGBullseye]

Those too.

[ThePest179]

http://www.rferl.org/content/iraq-deadly-clashes/25478952.html

 

Reports are coming in that Shia militias are almost as inefficient as their Iraqi Army counterparts*, and of course there's still the ethnic cleansing attitude that they're taking. Not good by any stretch of the imagination.

 

 

*This incompetence is not mentioned in the article.

 

EDIT: http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/world/middleeast/iraq/article4164627.ece

 

Definitely worrying when the Saudis can't trust their own troops.

[Vapymid]

I have noticed a change of tone in the recent coverage of ISIS in the media. I think that we are being prepared to accept that "ISIS will be there to stay" and "they are a bit extreme but not that bad, actually" and "maybe we'll just have to talk to them".

 

With Putin being the official Scarecrow No.1 and Israel causing continuing embarrassment for the West we don't want our attention drawn to an obvious failure of a 10-year long military adventure in a far away country, do we?

 

Regards

[ThePest179]

I have noticed a change of tone in the recent coverage of ISIS in the media. I think that we are being prepared to accept that "ISIS will be there to stay" and "they are a bit extreme but not that bad, actually" and "maybe we'll just have to talk to them".

 

With Putin being the official Scarecrow No.1 and Israel causing continuing embarrassment for the West we don't want our attention drawn to an obvious failure of a 10-year long military adventure in a far away country, do we?

 

Regards

 

A certain amount of political pundits would declare that the Iraq War was almost won were it not for Obama. Hell, I thought that way for a while, until the very obvious faults of the war were pointed out to me on a different forum.

 

As to whether ISIS is here to stay or "not that bad", ISIS probably will be around for a while; the immense dissatisfaction with the Gulf monarchies, the extremism bred by the Arab Spring, and the reputation ISIS has gained, means Western intervention would do little to them in the long run.

 

Not bad for a group which has been compared to the Khmer Rouge and Boko Haram.

[ThePest179]

Even the Kurds, the best equipped and led force in the region, is faltering against ISIS. FUCK!

 

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/08/03/us-iraq-security-idUSKBN0G20FU20140803

 

EDIT: http://www.dailystar.com.lb/News/Lebanon-News/2014/Jul-31/265570-hezbollah-commander-killed-in-iraq.ashx#axzz38psNrkDa

 

Hezbollah too. Good God.

 

EDIT2: http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/08/03/us-iraq-security-idUSKBN0G20FU20140803

 

More news from the Kurds.

 

EDIT3; http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/08/04/us-iraq-security-idUSKBN0G40ZY20140804

 

Kurds gearing up for a counteroffensive.