How does not run out of ammo?

[BTGBullseye]

That all still doesn't explain what kind of lunatic wouldn't quit after being stabbed so many times.

Unless he's got some other source of income, it's still a job, they're hard to find nowadays...

[Seattleite]

So we've got what, a smaller number with a smaller and vastly inferior weapon twice in a row, and almost no information in a third. Great evidence. And funnily enough, the part about him being a prison guard means I kinda believe you now. But first, explain how it makes sense to be able to survive 56 of something that one of is usually fatal. You know how. Go ahead and say it. It's one word, six letters. Starts with an "a", end with an "r". Something prison guards wear, that means he really wasn't stabbed because the object didn't enter significantly into his body.

 

Yeah, that's it. Armour. Prison guards wear armour. For this exact reason. Doesn't count.

 

How is a knife smaller than a shank? I could believe the shank being longer, but not bigger than the actual blade. The prison guard's Armour doesn't really help when you're being stabbed, shank or not. In regards to the deepness, you make a good point. There'd still be a fair amount of bleeding, probably enough to kill you without immediate attention, though.

 

That all still doesn't explain what kind of lunatic wouldn't quit after being stabbed so many times.

 

Wait, uh, disregard that question. We all know someone that's done that before.

 

Shivs are generally a sharp, thick piece of metal on the end of a long handle, like that of a fork. The handle has extra length to increase penetration depth without needing a longer blade, and other than being fragile is just as good. It's a better weapon due to its length.

 

Also, she was stabbed with a steak knife. Go look at your knife block. See the little ones on the bottom? Those are steak knives. No thickness, no breadth, and fairly short. And the scissors, while thick, taper too much and are too short. Neither one really works. Steak knives leave tiny wounds, and scissors don't reach vitals. A shiv is better than either.

 

Guard armour is thick and includes one trauma plate and one layer of chain. Underneath tgis is heavy padding. It's actually fairly effective against most improvised stabbing weapons, including shivs, forks, writing utensils and similar, as such a weapon would have to pierce the plate, then break the chain *and* depress the padding for the entire width of the plate. The heart is basically unreachable through it with anything shorter than 20cm, and difficult with anything under 30cm. Shivs may be longer than scissors and thicker than steak knives, but they're still too short to get in easily, and their thin design makes them too fragile to survive a hard enough impact to reach vitals. If it was 56 without breaking the shiv, they didn't put enough force in to do a damned thing or the handle would have snapped. It's more a prod than a stab.

 

And so what if you have other stories of similar but somewhat lesser stories? I can link to a guy who was shot 27 times with 9mm and .40 calibre bullets, and I really can, but if I said I knew somebody who was shot 32 times with a .45, that wouldn't be good evidence.

 

But we've hijacked this thread long enough, so let's stop.

[BTGBullseye]

Oddly I do know someone who was shot 22 times with a .45 when he tried to cross from Mexico... He survived...

[Seattleite]

Oddly I do know someone who was shot 22 times with a .45 when he tried to cross from Mexico... He survived...

 

So... What, are we sharing stories now? Okay.

 

Depending on how you look at it, I was shot a couple hundred times across my arms, legs and back when I was 8. If you count every individual pellet of #9 and don't require them to penetrate, otherwise I wasn't shot at all. I got into an argumemt with an old man about walking on his decorative lawn rocks, threw one at him, he ran inside and grabbed a shotgun. Did a number on my pants and jacket. I was also shot twice in the back with a .45 when I was 10. Just sitting there flirting with a girl, guy walks up and shoots us both. My best friend was shot three times an an AR-15 when he was 12, once in the head and twice in the back. Not going into circumstances there. My ex-wife was shot three times with .44 hollow points when she was 7. A loose dog attacked her and she beat it to death, its owner shot her in the back but thankfully was a shitty shot.

[BTGBullseye]

Oh, so nothing too terrible in your past then... Fairly normal childhood and so forth.

[Seattleite]

Oh, so nothing too terrible in your past then... Fairly normal childhood and so forth.

 

Eh. Was pretty good aside from that. I mean, sure, there's the shooting and those were nasty. And my ex losing half her family and suffering a breakdown. Then the phony "marriage" with a real judge, but a bride and groom too young to actually marry. And moving to a bible-thumping hick town against my will. Oh, and constantly being jealous of my best friend because he has a baby and I don't. But other than that, pretty good.

[BTGBullseye]

Yup... Pretty normal.

 

It's amazing we all seem to turn out so abnormal isn't it...

[Seattleite]

Yup... Pretty normal.

 

It's amazing we all seem to turn out so abnormal isn't it...

 

No comment.

[kingkolton9]

So we've got what, a smaller number with a smaller and vastly inferior weapon twice in a row, and almost no information in a third. Great evidence. And funnily enough, the part about him being a prison guard means I kinda believe you now. But first, explain how it makes sense to be able to survive 56 of something that one of is usually fatal. You know how. Go ahead and say it. It's one word, six letters. Starts with an "a", end with an "r". Something prison guards wear, that means he really wasn't stabbed because the object didn't enter significantly into his body.

 

Yeah, that's it. Armour. Prison guards wear armour. For this exact reason. Doesn't count.

 

How is a knife smaller than a shank? I could believe the shank being longer, but not bigger than the actual blade. The prison guard's Armour doesn't really help when you're being stabbed, shank or not. In regards to the deepness, you make a good point. There'd still be a fair amount of bleeding, probably enough to kill you without immediate attention, though.

 

That all still doesn't explain what kind of lunatic wouldn't quit after being stabbed so many times.

 

Wait, uh, disregard that question. We all know someone that's done that before.

 

Shivs are generally a sharp, thick piece of metal on the end of a long handle, like that of a fork. The handle has extra length to increase penetration depth without needing a longer blade, and other than being fragile is just as good. It's a better weapon due to its length.

 

Also, she was stabbed with a steak knife. Go look at your knife block. See the little ones on the bottom? Those are steak knives. No thickness, no breadth, and fairly short. And the scissors, while thick, taper too much and are too short. Neither one really works. Steak knives leave tiny wounds, and scissors don't reach vitals. A shiv is better than either.

 

Guard armour is thick and includes one trauma plate and one layer of chain. Underneath tgis is heavy padding. It's actually fairly effective against most improvised stabbing weapons, including shivs, forks, writing utensils and similar, as such a weapon would have to pierce the plate, then break the chain *and* depress the padding for the entire width of the plate. The heart is basically unreachable through it with anything shorter than 20cm, and difficult with anything under 30cm. Shivs may be longer than scissors and thicker than steak knives, but they're still too short to get in easily, and their thin design makes them too fragile to survive a hard enough impact to reach vitals. If it was 56 without breaking the shiv, they didn't put enough force in to do a damned thing or the handle would have snapped. It's more a prod than a stab.

 

And so what if you have other stories of similar but somewhat lesser stories? I can link to a guy who was shot 27 times with 9mm and .40 calibre bullets, and I really can, but if I said I knew somebody who was shot 32 times with a .45, that wouldn't be good evidence.

 

But we've hijacked this thread long enough, so let's stop.

 

Then I guess it was better than I thought that he wore his armor.

[Seattleite]

Then I guess it was better than I thought that he wore his armor.

 

And that the inmates didn't have a real knife they could have really stabbed him with and not risked breaking it, and that the inmate was likely stabbing him out of anger, not fear. If you want to know the difference between what happened with him and a real stabbing, go pick up a pair of scissors. Look at the last centimetre of that, then look at a knife. There's the difference in the wound alone. Even that isn't all of it, there's a difference in the impact between a light hit on body armour being careful not to break a shiv, and a hard stab into soft, squishy flesh. The former barely hurts, the latter would crack bones and damage organs even without a knife present.

 

And neither of them compares to the kind of force people put in when in a life or death situation. We always hold back no matter what, being careful not to cause ourselves injury and only using a little of our strength. In a life or death situation, which we have failed to handle with our brains, we stop conserving as much of our strength and stop worrying about whether we're going to break out wrist, or throw out a shoulder. We still don't hit as hard as we really can, but we put in a whole lot more force than we would normally put into anything. In that circumstance even just a punch would break ribs, rupture lungs, and possibly force the broken ends of those ribs through the lungs, quite likely leaving a fatal wound even without a weapon. With a blade, so much force is put into it that the user's hand frequently forces its way into the wound. Had the inmate stabbed him out of fear for his life, which is way more likely than you might think because no matter who your friend is normally as a person he's going to be a total bastard as a prison guard by the very nature of the job (look up the Stanford Prison Experiment, a frequently replicated and confirmed experiment on the matter), your friend would be dead no matter what weapon his attacker used. Even if the attacker didn't have a weapon he'd be dead. He would have been dead before medical attention even became a factor, or before the attack was even close to over.

[kingkolton9]

Then I guess it was better than I thought that he wore his armor.

 

And that the inmates didn't have a real knife they could have really stabbed him with and not risked breaking it, and that the inmate was likely stabbing him out of anger, not fear. If you want to know the difference between what happened with him and a real stabbing, go pick up a pair of scissors. Look at the last centimetre of that, then look at a knife. There's the difference in the wound alone. Even that isn't all of it, there's a difference in the impact between a light hit on body armour being careful not to break a shiv, and a hard stab into soft, squishy flesh. The former barely hurts, the latter would crack bones and damage organs even without a knife present.

 

And neither of them compares to the kind of force people put in when in a life or death situation. We always hold back no matter what, being careful not to cause ourselves injury and only using a little of our strength. In a life or death situation, which we have failed to handle with our brains, we stop conserving as much of our strength and stop worrying about whether we're going to break out wrist, or throw out a shoulder. We still don't hit as hard as we really can, but we put in a whole lot more force than we would normally put into anything. In that circumstance even just a punch would break ribs, rupture lungs, and possibly force the broken ends of those ribs through the lungs, quite likely leaving a fatal wound even without a weapon. With a blade, so much force is put into it that the user's hand frequently forces its way into the wound. Had the inmate stabbed him out of fear for his life, which is way more likely than you might think because no matter who your friend is normally as a person he's going to be a total bastard as a prison guard by the very nature of the job (look up the Stanford Prison Experiment, a frequently replicated and confirmed experiment on the matter), your friend would be dead no matter what weapon his attacker used. Even if the attacker didn't have a weapon he'd be dead. He would have been dead before medical attention even became a factor, or before the attack was even close to over.

 

Tough-asses don't last in prison. I mean, you've got thousands of inmates and a hundred guards. It just seems like they'd be dead before the day's over, doesn't it? I'm probably wrong, though.

 

Whatever the inmate used (I can't say what exactly he used for a shiv; wouldn't know) somehow pierced his armor. He obviously bled, so I wonder: How many light pierces would it take for someone to bleed to death, given enough time?

[Seattleite]

Tough-asses don't last in prison. I mean, you've got thousands of inmates and a hundred guards. It just seems like they'd be dead before the day's over, doesn't it? I'm probably wrong, though.

 

Whatever the inmate used (I can't say what exactly he used for a shiv; wouldn't know) somehow pierced his armor. He obviously bled, so I wonder: How many light pierces would it take for someone to bleed to death, given enough time?

 

That is so far from true that I can't decide if I find it depressing or hilarious that you believe it. The people we send to prison aren't a bunch of violent animals. Certainly some are, bur they're a tiny minority just amongst the people who actually did something, who are in turn a tiny minority. Most people in prison are there for minor drug offenses. They never did a fucking thing wrong, and they got thrown into an environment of intolerable abuse and daily loss of human dignity so people like your friend's scumbag boss can keep soaking up massive amounts of goverment money. Most of them are timid, cowardly victims of our corrupt and abusive system who would give anything to be treated like a fucking human being again. And if you think most of the abuse comes from other inmates, you're wrong. Prison guards, by their very nature, abuse the inmates constantly and think they're entirely justified because they see the people on the other side of the bars as subhuman animals, just like you do, even though all most of them did was put a substance into their OWN BODY.

 

Which is done at the same time that the pharmaceutical industry rakes in massive amounts of money selling unsafe drugs like ritalin, oxycodone and methamphetamine (why yes, methamphetamine is also used as a psychiatric medication for two "illnesses" that don't exist), that they know aren't safe and are likely to kill people, including children which two of those three are primarily prescribed for, which the FDA knows aren't safe and doesn't do a damned thing about because they're just as bought off as the congressmen that keep our ridiculous drug war going.

[kingkolton9]

That is so far from true that I can't decide if I find it depressing or hilarious that you believe it. The people we send to prison aren't a bunch of violent animals. Certainly some are, bur they're a tiny minority just amongst the people who actually did something, who are in turn a tiny minority. Most people in prison are there for minor drug offenses. They never did a fucking thing wrong, and they got thrown into an environment of intolerable abuse and daily loss of human dignity so people like your friend's scumbag boss can keep soaking up massive amounts of goverment money. Most of them are timid, cowardly victims of our corrupt and abusive system who would give anything to be treated like a fucking human being again. And if you think most of the abuse comes from other inmates, you're wrong. Prison guards, by their very nature, abuse the inmates constantly and think they're entirely justified because they see the people on the other side of the bars as subhuman animals, just like you do, even though all most of them did was put a substance into their OWN BODY.

 

Which is done at the same time that the pharmaceutical industry rakes in massive amounts of money selling unsafe drugs like ritalin, oxycodone and methamphetamine (why yes, methamphetamine is also used as a psychiatric medication for two "illnesses" that don't exist), that they know aren't safe and are likely to kill people, including children which two of those three are primarily prescribed for, which the FDA knows aren't safe and doesn't do a damned thing about because they're just as bought off as the congressmen that keep our ridiculous drug war going.

 

No, I do not see them as subhuman animals. There are people in prisons for a host of reasons. When you piss someone off that's in for a life sentence, they'll just try to kill you. What are you going to do, throw them in prison?

 

I'm done talking to you, if I say anything else, i'll say the wrong thing. You've called me a liar, a fool, and then told me that I don't think prisoners are people. I'm out.

[VeryShyPerson]

How the hell did a discussion on whether givecurrentammo is used in the video turn into a political thread? I think this thread's long past its best-before date.

[Seattleite]

No, I do not see them as subhuman animals. There are people in prisons for a host of reasons. When you piss someone off that's in for a life sentence, they'll just try to kill you. What are you going to do, throw them in prison?

 

I'm done talking to you, if I say anything else, i'll say the wrong thing. You've called me a liar, a fool, and then told me that I don't think prisoners are people. I'm out.

 

You just proved it, when you said that a prisoner would probably kill anyone who angered them just because they can't be punished any more. Three problems with that.

 

1. This is demonstrably not true. There are worse things guards can do to a prisoner, such as put them in solitary confinement. Which is the default response to violence, I might add. Solitary is so much worse than regular prison it's silly to even compare them. It's basically a never ending psychological torture that gets worse and worse as it goes on.

 

2. Fear keeps them from attacking guards. They are intimidated, and after enough time grow timid in the guards' presence to avoid the guards' attention and further injury. As a result, any violence on their part would be directed towards other prisoners.

 

3. Most people find the idea of killing another person repulsive, especially one they know, even if that person is abusing them. They won't kill a guard simply because they don't want to.

 

Do guards get attacked? Yes. They get attacked by three classes of people, though.

 

1. New "tough guy" inmates. These guys stop real fast when they realise they aren't hot shit, but there are plenty of cocky violent bastards who get sent to jail. Sure, they're a small minority, but there's always at least one in there.

 

2. Cocky prison-yard shieks. This is rare, but some guys in prison think they run the fucking place. And if a guard cuts off their smuggling op or whatever, they might order one of the other inmates to kill them. This is probably what got your friend.

 

3. Suicidal/mentally ill inmates. There are a decent number of people who are suicidal or mentally ill when sent to jail. It basically ruins your entire life forever, so that's to be expected. Plenty of regular people become suicidal or mentally ill in prison due to the squalid conditions, abhorrent abuse and intentional deprivation of basic human dignity, or top of your whole life being ruined forever. Spending enough time in solitary is 100% guaranteed to cause psychological degredation and people with long sentences tend to become suicidal after coming out of a couple weeks of solitary. Most of those people never did a thing wrong before they were put in prison and now they're abused so bad they want to die. They'll frequently attack a guard when wronged by them just because they don't care anymore and if they get killed at least it'll be over. These are unfortunately quite common.

Edited March 23, 2014 by Guest (see edit history)

[Seattleite]

How the hell did a discussion on whether givecurrentammo is used in the video turn into a political thread? I think this thread's long past its best-before date.

 

HATE.

 

Seriously, though, it just kinda did. The internet is like this sometimes.