Israeli-Palestinian conflict

[BTGBullseye]

I don't hide meaning in words. If I intend a meaning, it will be a blunt statement, not an unsaid hidden veiled comment. (I loathe being anything but blunt, way too easy to get misunderstandings)

[ThePest179]

Getting reports now that Israel is forcing 40% of the population of Gaza deeper into the interior, in an attempt to depopulate the area of Palestinians. The "zone" would be 3km deep into Gaza. This probably signifies Israel crossing the Moral Event Horizon in this new conflict. I mean Jesus Christ.

[BTGBullseye]

I think they just want those people out far enough that it's easier to make a DMZ and add an AMS to their border to reduce the rocket damage.

[ThePest179]

I think they just want those people out far enough that it's easier to make a DMZ and add an AMS to their border to reduce the rocket damage.

 

But this removes everyone in that area from their homes, creating a large mass of unemployed refugees, and the extra people added to the rest of Gaza increases its population density, causing more casualties and "collateral damage", intentional or not.

 

This is a war crime.

[Vapymid]

This also doesn't make any more friends for Israel, does it?

 

Every child who will have survived this and witnessed the destruction of their home, death of a schoolmate or a sibling or the parents - they will be living with the hatred of Israel inside them for the rest of their lives. They won't need any additional persuasion that "Israel should be wiped off the map".

 

Regards

[BTGBullseye]

People make mistakes... A country is just a bunch of people... Israel makes mistakes, and this may be one of them, but maybe it isn't... We can't know for sure until time has passed.

[ThePest179]

People make mistakes... A country is just a bunch of people... Israel makes mistakes, and this may be one of them, but maybe it isn't... We can't know for sure until time has passed.

 

Mistake or no, it's criminal.

[BTGBullseye]

And what do you propose would fix the problem? I'm not arguing, I'm just asking if you know of any way that will actually work to both side's advantage, and won't compromise either to the terrorists.

[ThePest179]

And what do you propose would fix the problem? I'm not arguing, I'm just asking if you know of any way that will actually work to both side's advantage, and won't compromise either to the terrorists.

 

Well we're going to need to end the blockade, open some borders, etc., but we're also going to need Hamas to negotiate or simply stand down. In any case, there probably isn't a solution to the problem, there's too much hatred between both sides and the two state solution has died with the Israeli settlements in the West Bank.

[BTGBullseye]

And therein lies the problem, so as far as I can see, Israel is doing what they can to stop terrorist attacks on civilian targets.

[Vapymid]

If that's what they think they're doing - they are governed by a bunch of morons and should think of a regime change ASAP. But that would be too good to be true.

 

Regards

[ThePest179]

And therein lies the problem, so as far as I can see, Israel is doing what they can to stop terrorist attacks on civilian targets.

 

I must say to you that unless freedom of movement and an end to the blockade comes, they will join those terrorrists in droves, and have been for quite a while. I also must say that Israel wouldn't accept what I propoeed, either out of fear or hate, but they wouldn't accept it.

 

At this point in the game the two state solution is dead.

[BTGBullseye]

So what you're saying is that a currently infeasible solution is the only one that can fix the problem, and the one they're trying now can't possibly work?

[ThePest179]

So what you're saying is that a currently infeasible solution is the only one that can fix the problem, and the one they're trying now can't possibly work?

 

Yes. Neither side would agree to a deal that would leave them better off, no matter how much you try to convince them. They just won't agree. Ever.

[BTGBullseye]

So, what is the best solution given the current circumstances? (this includes that the previously mentioned solution is not possible, and the reasons it's not possible)

[ThePest179]

So, what is the best solution given the current circumstances?

 

Since removing the blockade against Gaza isn't an option, I would have to say the status quo, unfortunately. Except instead of Israel slaughtering civilians with reckless abandon, they could use Mossad and Special Forces to take out rockets.

[BTGBullseye]

They tried that... Unfortunately the rockets are built and moved on the day they are fired, and it's so far produced no predictable pattern.

 

As far a the 'slaughtering', I thought you said they were simply moving them, not killing them...

[Vapymid]

Destroying the rockets won't do anything. Rockets are simple symptoms. It's like a tortured animal lashing out at his torturer as he walks into the cage...

 

The real trouble is that there is no desire on either side to solve the problems. It is obvious that Israel is governed by people who openly believe in only one solution - where there are no Palestinians left on the territory of the country. Either through exodus or through genocide, they don't care which way. On the Palestinian side - they understand that, and they think that violence is their only option.

 

Both sides need to change but Israel must do that first and it just isn't going to happen anytime soon, or until there is a real pressure from outside (what are the chances of that happening?).

 

In the end to resolve the crisis it will take one night, and nine months, and forty years. The "old dinosaurs" will have to die out and a new generation, the one capable of seeing reason, to take over.

 

Regards

[ThePest179]

They tried that.

 

Bullshit. I don't believe you for a second.

 

As far a the 'slaughtering', I thought you said they were simply moving them, not killing them.

 

The slaughter refers to the hellish air campaign. And the mass evictions are not much better, it's ethnic cleansing.

[BTGBullseye]

I don't believe you for a second.

You're entitled to believe what you will, when have I ever said otherwise?

 

The slaughter refers to the hellish air campaign. And the mass evictions are not much better, it's ethnic cleansing.

Ok, how many casualties have occurred?

 

Also, doesn't everyone know that there are very few locations on the planet (and even in the USA) where two different (or even extremely similar) religions can get along 'en masse' without violence? How is separating two groups (ethnic cleansing) that will pretty much inevitably turn to trying to wipe each other out be that horrible?

 

 

 

Please try not to take this personally, you start getting violent when that happens.