Does God exist? (your opinion anyways.)

[alphabetagamma]

Firstly, defending something against criticism makes that something stronger. Way too many people I know claim a really poorly thought out belief system. If what you believe can't stand up to criticism, it's not a very good belief.

 

Secondly, some things are true whether you believe them or not. God cannot be both absolute and subjective. It doesn't work.

 

And finally, I go to a christian school, so I get an interesting perspective into christian education. And I can tell you there's nothing more annoying to most of the teachers and students than flip-floppy christians. Making your own take on christianity may have been okay in the 16th century, but mixing it with new age ideas, or taking the Bible as true in some places and not in others is not considered christianity by most people here.

[Ian]

Personally, the Judeo-Christian God sounds too much like an ancient king than an omniscient, universe-creating being. I don't think Christianity is popular around the world because it is the correct or least nonsensical religion, but because it spread amongst the lowest but most populated portion of the Roman Empire, and has been passed down traditionally since.

[Alyxx Thorne]

The thing is that I don't really feel he criticized my religion or my faith, just said that he doesn't believe it, which I think is fair. It's a question of faith and faith has nothing to do with any scientific facts to be honest. I'm not trying to disprove any science, I'm just stating that in my eyes, God is real because I personally can't imagine why he wouldn't be. I don't know how that makes me blissfully ignorant because I have made no attempts at criticizing anything Eedo Baba has written aside from the fact he's constantly criticizing me.

[Eedo Baba]

The thing is that I don't really feel he criticized my religion or my faith, just said that he doesn't believe it, which I think is fair. It's a question of faith and faith has nothing to do with any scientific facts to be honest. I'm not trying to disprove any science, I'm just stating that in my eyes, God is real because I personally can't imagine why he wouldn't be. I don't know how that makes me blissfully ignorant because I have made no attempts at criticizing anything Eedo Baba has written aside from the fact he's constantly criticizing me.

 

Again, I don't mean to attack you personally. My criticism is of society and religious thinking at large. I think it damages intellectual discourse and sets a sad precedent for backwards thinking and baseless beliefs. If you take that as a personal attack, it's only because you happen to take part in such thinking.

[Alyxx Thorne]

And my criticism was never directed towards your way of thinking at all. So... peace then?

[Eedo Baba]

And my criticism was never directed towards your way of thinking at all. So... peace then?

 

Sure. I've certainly gotten my point across by now.

[Alyxx Thorne]

I feel I have as well. So let's hear some other opinions.

[Doom Shepherd]

Making your own take on christianity may have been okay in the 16th century, but mixing it with new age ideas, or taking the Bible as true in some places and not in others is not considered christianity by most people here.

 

Well, I can forgive taking the Bible as not true in some places more easily than I can insisting that it's always literally true and perfect, especially since there's some cases (details, mainly) where it's demonstrably untrue: locusts have six legs, a bat is not a bird, the Earth has no corners. Really, it makes a lot MORE sense to treat the earliest Bible stories, like Genesis, as parables or "Just So" stories like "How the leopard got his stripes." - the best explanations that unscientific, basically ignorant minds (ignorant here not meaning stupid, just uninformed) could come up with at the time. But nowadays, we know a little better.

 

(You run into problems here, as the NT is pretty silly without certain parts of the OT, parts which really can't be literally true, - Jesus came to fix what Adam and Eve did, but Adam and Eve... but that's another argument.)

 

On the other hand, you have a whole lot of prople who call themselves Christians, who really don't seem to follow Christ's teaching to any significant extent. Or conversely, add stuff that isn't there or discard stuff that they really have to keep to be a "Christian," like the concepts of Hell and the divinity of Jesus. (There are people who call themselves"Christians" who don't believe in sin, or even God. How is THAT supposed to work??)

 

SiN, at least, professes to believe that the NT should take precedence over the OT - which is the most sensible theology of that branch, and I won't criticize that. (Although I still reserve the option of criticizing any people who put far too much emphasis on Paul at the expense of Jesus, the guy the religion's actually named for.)

 

What bugs me most of all is the same thing that seems to bug Eedo Baba... when "believers" (of any stripe) use professions of faith to avoid thinking about stuff like the reality of scientific fact, just because the facts conflict with their Just So story, and begin expressing uninformed opinions (such as "evolution is JUST a theory") despite having no idea what they are talking about. Beliefs aren't facts, and facts exist independently of belief.

 

Believe whatever you want. Just don't try to tell me that your beliefs overrule my facts. They don't, can't, and shouldn't, and I will fight you if you try to force it to be otherwise. Barring that, peace be upon you.

 

And I'll wrap it up with my last statement of OPINION: There are no whys. There are only hows. Even the things we like to think are whys are just very complex hows. That's it.

[Alyxx Thorne]

At least you are stressing that your statement is opinion. And I think ultimately, it all depends on your own perspective. I don't think evolution is just a theory because there's a lot of strong evidence for it. But I think science and religion can easily co-exist and compliment each other, I just think a lot of Christians aren't liberal enough, or open-minded enough, to see the big picture and easily get too focused on what the bible says rather than the core of the religion.

 

I think God exists because in my eyes there's evidence for it everywhere, that's just my perspective of things. I have still yet to see any evidence of him not existing.

[Pinkie Pie]

You can't really prove or disprove God, which is why I think people should stop arguing about it. Just let those who believe in him, believe in him. It's their decision and you should respect that.

Edited January 21, 2012 by Guest (see edit history)

[Chuckthe2nd]

I think Pinkie pretty much summed this up. Let's just leave it at that.

[Michael Archer]

I like Pinkie's response. It's mature and thought out.

 

Well, there's no physical and empirical evidence for a God so I don't think there's a God. If you do, that's fine and that your right. If you can prove there's a God, then I'll sign up with my local church or synagogue immediately.

[Alyxx Thorne]

Religion will always be highly subjective anyway.

[Kirkreng]

Religion will always be completely subjective. It has been objectively disproven many times before, whether you are religious or not, you cannot deny facts. But that is besides the point anyway. What I am more interested in is why there is such faith and how it grew so big rather then beating a dead horse and trying to change a religious man/woman.

[Alyxx Thorne]

Because faith gives strength, and hope, and a feeling that there is more to this world than you can touch and see, there is also what you can feel. It's entirely abstract, emotional and spiritual, which is probably why religion is often applied to music, movies and other forms of art. And that's also why I think it's generally a bad idea to apply religion to politics.

[Kirkreng]

And that's also why I think it's generally a bad idea to apply religion to politics.

Could not agree more.

[alphabetagamma]

Making your own take on christianity may have been okay in the 16th century, but mixing it with new age ideas, or taking the Bible as true in some places and not in others is not considered christianity by most people here.

Well, I can forgive taking the Bible as not true in some places more easily than I can insisting that it's always literally true and perfect, especially since there's some cases (details, mainly) where it's demonstrably untrue: locusts have six legs, a bat is not a bird, the Earth has no corners. Really, it makes a lot MORE sense to treat the earliest Bible stories, like Genesis, as parables or "Just So" stories like "How the leopard got his stripes." - the best explanations that unscientific, basically ignorant minds (ignorant here not meaning stupid, just uninformed) could come up with at the time. But nowadays, we know a little better.

Well what defines a 'bird' has changed of course, but I agree. The Bible doesn't have to be literally true in all places, but when it directly specifies a point (e.g. homosexuality being a sin), denying that it is while still calling yourself a Christian isn't really accurate.

[Alyxx Thorne]

I don't deny homosexuality being a sin, because any kind of sexuality or lust is a sin per definition. But I consider it less of a sin than, for instance, killing someone else not in self defense. I do believe however that the bible DOES allow love between two of the same sex though, and that only the act itself is considered sinful.

 

But it's up to every Christian how important this is or not. If you want to go around worrying about sins you're not gonna be able to enjoy life much imo. We're all sinners, and God forgives all sins if you make up for them in some way, which is why I think it's possible to be a lesbian or gay and still have faith in God.

[BTGBullseye]

I do believe however that the bible DOES allow love between two of the same sex though, and that only the act itself is considered sinful.

If anybody ever tells you otherwise, they are wrong.

 

I think you all know what I believe as far as God existing, etc. I'll just leave you with this little tidbit...

 

Belief in God (as most of you are viewing it) is equivalent to believing that evolution is more than just an unproven theory partially supported by some facts.

Edited January 26, 2012 by Guest (see edit history)

[alphabetagamma]

From my understanding, the basis of Christianity is faith that Jesus existed, was God, died for all sins and rose from the dead. God will forgive all (or in some stances, most) sins as long as the sinner is repentant. You don't have to make up for sin in any way, you just have to regret sinning and ask forgiveness from God.

I don't deny homosexuality being a sin, because any kind of sexuality or lust is a sin per definition.

Sex inside of marriage is certainly not considered a sin.

Belief in God (as most of you are viewing it) is equivalent to believing that evolution is more than just an unproven theory that supports some facts.

Evolution isn't a theory that supports some facts, it's a theory that is supported by facts.